Massive Is Dying Akk Everyone Yelllllllllllllll!

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MokeDuck

MokeDuck

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I just wanna see popular opinion from non-RPers on my opinion that massive desperately needs a factions reset, a factions content update, some other major change to faction mechanics or just some way to increase player retention in general. Short and simple now everyone like, subscribe and go argue with eachother in the comment section down below
 
Is this because of PvP combat not being what people want? I'm only asking because I've been looking at a lot of videos on YouTube about how Minecraft is not what it was meant to be and how it's dying, and it always comes down to someone who simply doesn't like how the combat system has changed. But Minecraft was never about pvp combat. Now, if that's not what this is about, cool. Great, actually.

Since I'm just starting out in massive I'm noticing a few things that could be better. I'm already wishing one could be more independent and not rely on any faction at all.
 
StarOfElyon said:
Is this because of PvP combat not being what people want? I'm only asking because I've been looking at a lot of videos on YouTube about how Minecraft is not what it was meant to be and how it's dying, and it always comes down to someone who simply doesn't like how the combat system has changed. But Minecraft was never about pvp combat. Now, if that's not what this is about, cool. Great, actually.

Since I'm just starting out in massive I'm noticing a few things that could be better. I'm already wishing one could be more independent and not rely on any faction at all.
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Minecraft was never about anything. It was about doing what you wanted, that's the definition of a sandbox. Mining and ROLEPLAYING are equally as relevant as PvPing.

"Someone who simply doesn't like how the combat system has changed"
You mean, like, 70 percent of the community who actually use a combat system? Reddit does not speak for the entirety of the Minecraft playerbase, which is why they said they were reconsidering the combat system in a recent tweet. No one likes it. Not survivalists cause it makes PvE basically impossible if there's a large mob of enemies, not PvPers for obvious reasons, and everyone else who doesn't need a combat system anyway makes their opinion completely irrelevant.

"Since I'm just starting out in massive I'm noticing a few things that could be better. I'm already wishing one could be more independent and not rely on any faction at all."
No. This is already the case. You don't need a Faction for anything really on massive, which in my opinion is a big problem considering Massive became popular BECAUSE of factions and BECAUSE it was the server that made the entire factions plugin to begin with.
 
Make survival more lore compliant and any progression events that happen in regalia reflect into survival, e.g another void invasion changes a heap of massive mobs, or a famine disabling plant growth, disable spawning of passive mobs, disable food traits
 
grizenator said:
Make survival more lore compliant and any progression events that happen in regalia reflect into survival, e.g another void invasion changes a heap of massive mobs, or a famine disabling plant growth, disable spawning of passive mobs, disable food traits
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Most progressions are about one noble taunting another, riots in the Archipelago for tax breaks or negotiations between nobles. Not much of a chance any of those would reflect outside the Archipelago.
 
grizenator said:
Make survival more lore compliant and any progression events that happen in regalia reflect into survival, e.g another void invasion changes a heap of massive mobs, or a famine disabling plant growth, disable spawning of passive mobs, disable food traits
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Factions can become more lore compliant through joining Crisis of Kings, I know that CoK is not made for everyone and not all factions are apart of it, but it gives a starting point and it's actually pretty easy to achieve the requirements for a CoK faction.

While I would love to see factions become lore compliant and I would love the ability to write a in-depth, canonized faction background, lore staff have said time and time again that the quality of the lore may not be of a standard that they wish to display for all to see. I still think factions should write their own lore, maybe even get their own roleplayer's to comply with it, it's really up to them.
 
Winterless said:
Minecraft was never about anything. It was about doing what you wanted, that's the definition of a sandbox. Mining and ROLEPLAYING are equally as relevant as PvPing.

"Someone who simply doesn't like how the combat system has changed"
You mean, like, 70 percent of the community who actually use a combat system? Reddit does not speak for the entirety of the Minecraft playerbase, which is why they said they were reconsidering the combat system in a recent tweet. No one likes it. Not survivalists cause it makes PvE basically impossible if there's a large mob of enemies, not PvPers for obvious reasons, and everyone else who doesn't need a combat system anyway makes their opinion completely irrelevant.

"Since I'm just starting out in massive I'm noticing a few things that could be better. I'm already wishing one could be more independent and not rely on any faction at all."
No. This is already the case. You don't need a Faction for anything really on massive, which in my opinion is a big problem considering Massive became popular BECAUSE of factions and BECAUSE it was the server that made the entire factions plugin to begin with.
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I've heard differently about factions as a new player. I've been told that the reason the mobs are overwhelming me is that I haven't gotten enough help from my faction yet.
 
StarOfElyon said:
I've heard differently about factions as a new player. I've been told that the reason the mobs are overwhelming me is that I haven't gotten enough help from my faction yet.
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I think they were going to change mobs AGES back, but the guy in charge dropped off the face of the earth and never got it done
 
CnocBride said:
Factions can become more lore compliant through joining Crisis of Kings, I know that CoK is not made for everyone and not all factions are apart of it, but it gives a starting point and it's actually pretty easy to achieve the requirements for a CoK faction.

While I would love to see factions become lore compliant and I would love the ability to write a in-depth, canonized faction background, lore staff have said time and time again that the quality of the lore may not be of a standard that they wish to display for all to see. I still think factions should write their own lore, maybe even get their own roleplayer's to comply with it, it's really up to them.
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to be totally honest, the Wiki's lore shouldn't be held up as a shining beacon either

Some of the stuff in there is actually laughable, like forges made of common magma that can somehow melt iron, or people wielding a longsword as a.. shield?

There needs to be a serious rework of lore in general to be honest, I think there's way too much power given to Regalia, like their army of one million strong or whatever I read on the wiki ages back
 
Just put out more content for survival worlds so factions have something to work towards rather than stagnate. Too many factions reach this fall off point where they hit a wall and can't make anymore meaningful accomplishments and then the factions suffers because members leave because there isn't anything to do.
 
Alj23 said:
Just put out more content for survival worlds so factions have something to work towards rather than stagnate. Too many factions reach this fall off point where they hit a wall and can't make anymore meaningful accomplishments and then the factions suffers because members leave because there isn't anything to do.
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What types of things could we do to help keep factions interesting and fresh?
Maybe this is a problem with Minecraft in general? Once you beat the dragon what do you do?
I have been able to keep myself interested by using roleplaying as a sort of replacement Minecraft end game.

I would love to help give you the tools you need to stay interested. What can we do to help?
 
DrFong said:
What types of things could we do to help keep factions interesting and fresh?
Maybe this is a problem with Minecraft in general? Once you beat the dragon what do you do?
I have been able to keep myself interested by using roleplaying as a sort of replacement Minecraft end game.

I would love to help give you the tools you need to stay interested. What can we do to help?
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Right, you've substituted roleplay as your main form of entertainment on MassiveCraft (Minecraft) instead of mainly the game itself, and since there are constant lore additions, rewrites to add new material/fix problems in the lore, and world progression events, you haven't had to experience an endgame without any content. That's probably the biggest difference between survival and roleplay. Roleplay has had constant content added to it, so there's always something to do. That's why it's flourishing so much.

As for factions endgame content, there needs to be something for all types of factions players to work towards and accomplish beyond the goals they set for themselves. PVPers need to have satisfying PVP that is constantly monitored, balanced, and when needed fixed by the staff. That isn't the case at the moment. People that start factions to try and achieve some personal goal they set for themselves need content to experience on the way to achieving their goal as well as content to do after/if they achieve their goal.

Some ideas I've had:
  • accomplishment/goal system built into factions very similar to most MMORPGS. Ex: Have a population of 10 members. 20 members. 50 members. 100 members, etc. Have 10k in faction bank. 20k. 50k, etc. Possibly either hand out tokens to the faction leader upon reaching the goal or make a command where you can view all a factions accomplishment and the date they achieved it. As long as it's an extensive list of accomplishments, people will work to achieve them.
  • Obviously the very much wanted empire expansion. This would satisfy a ton of people that have always dreamed of empire building but MassiveCraft lacked the interface and faction infrastructure to do so. Having sub-factions physically recognized ingame by the plugin is a big think people want, rather than a google document or a forum post or just (empire name here in desc). The ability to tax them, have empire claims, and an empire bank built into a plugin is also really important.
There's a lot more. I know there is. I can't faithfully sit here and speak for whatever primarily factions players want though. Just what I want.. Above are just two ideas I've had bouncing around in my head for awhile. We could sit down and brainstorm stuff for ages, but it means nothing if they never get implemented.
 
Alj23 said:
What you said.
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I think you raise some great points and ideas! Lack of meaningful endgame in survival seems to be one of the problems.

It's really hard to have plugins written/updated and new systems created in survival. Roleplay is easy to make changes, write some lore, progression post, boom, done; roleplayers have something fun to do for the weekend.

Survival and pvp seem to be much harder changes to implement that require much coding and balancing etc.

I wonder if there are ways to jazz up survival play that we can come up with ourselves and implement as players. I've always been one to make my own systems and fun where none exists. I think CoK is a step in the right direction. Like roleplay, it didn't require tons of coding and tweeking plugins to get it working. Does it even need staff? It could have been created and run totally by players.

I understand being frustrated waiting for updates that seem to never come. So, what games, systems, fun-generators could we implement in survival with the tools we already have in place?

Rather than a bad time, think of now as a perfect opportunity to start something new and exciting for our fellow players!
 
DrFong said:
I think you raise some great points and ideas! Lack of meaningful endgame in survival seems to be one of the problems.

It's really hard to have plugins written/updated and new systems created in survival. Roleplay is easy to make changes, write some lore, progression post, boom, done; roleplayers have something fun to do for the weekend.

Survival and pvp seem to be much harder changes to implement that require much coding and balancing etc.

I wonder if there are ways to jazz up survival play that we can come up with ourselves and implement as players. I've always been one to make my own systems and fun where none exists. I think CoK is a step in the right direction. Like roleplay, it didn't require tons of coding and tweeking plugins to get it working. Does it even need staff? It could have been created and run totally by players.

I understand being frustrated waiting for updates that seem to never come. So, what games, systems, fun-generators could we implement in survival with the tools we already have in place?

Rather than a bad time, think of now as a perfect opportunity to start something new and exciting for our fellow players!
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It's quite easy to make it interesting, at least from where I'm standing. Make events that happen in Factions written into the lore, with major battles being made apparent to roleplayers in Regalia. Add things that Factions players want, such as the Empires plugin as people have pointed out, or PvP changes that players want. I think stronger lore integration and a more active playerbase will encourage interest in factions tbh
 
Winterless said:
It's quite easy to make it interesting, at least from where I'm standing. Make events that happen in Factions written into the lore, with major battles being made apparent to roleplayers in Regalia. Add things that Factions players want, such as the Empires plugin as people have pointed out, or PvP changes that players want. I think stronger lore integration and a more active playerbase will encourage interest in factions tbh
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What changes to Factions/PvP would you like to see that don't involve Regalia?
 
DrFong said:
I think you raise some great points and ideas! Lack of meaningful endgame in survival seems to be one of the problems.

It's really hard to have plugins written/updated and new systems created in survival. Roleplay is easy to make changes, write some lore, progression post, boom, done; roleplayers have something fun to do for the weekend.

Survival and pvp seem to be much harder changes to implement that require much coding and balancing etc.

I wonder if there are ways to jazz up survival play that we can come up with ourselves and implement as players. I've always been one to make my own systems and fun where none exists. I think CoK is a step in the right direction. Like roleplay, it didn't require tons of coding and tweeking plugins to get it working. Does it even need staff? It could have been created and run totally by players.

I understand being frustrated waiting for updates that seem to never come. So, what games, systems, fun-generators could we implement in survival with the tools we already have in place?

Rather than a bad time, think of now as a perfect opportunity to start something new and exciting for our fellow players!
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Why is survival expected to always create their own content, but as you stated, role play is easy to make changes so it gets done for them by a whole department of staff. Is it the simple fact that survival and pvp are so hard to change and implement new content for that it's not worth the staff's time or they just choose not to tackle it? It's something, or else we'd have gotten new content consistently ages ago. I want to know when it became normal and accepted for the staff to look at the two gameplay styles and decide that only one of them deserved it's own department and weekly content releases.

The home of the factions plugin should have the best factions gameplay. Period. It's kind of pathetic that it doesn't. I'm tired of being told that I need to come up with games, systems, and fun-generators on my own if I want more content to experience, and then sit and watch numerous lore rewrites and progression post posted to the forums in a single week. You've got to see the issue here: roleplay ask for something to be done, the lore staff jump. Pvp and survival ask for something to be done, we're told to go jump off a cliff and do it ourselves.

If players could successfully create their own content to keep everyone busy in the survival worlds, you would have seen it already, and we wouldn't be asking for something, anything new to be added. The survival worlds require more tangible infrastructure. Physical additions of content. The requested Empire expansion is a good example. People want to build empires. They want to physically do it in game via a plug-in. There is a demand, and there has been for a long time. You'd think the MassiveCraft staff would provide the supply. Every time someone has wanted to build an empire, the best they can do is have someone slap (empire name here) in their faction description and that's that. And it always falls apart, because what we've asked for consistently to make it work hasn't been provided to us. But damn did that whole lore race rewrite sure get pumped out fast. Because the environment of roleplay deemed it necessary.

A whole lot of things have been deemed necessary by the environment of pvp and survival, and yet they haven't been implemented. It's a damn shame. The same standards executed for roleplay haven't been executed for pvp and survival. That's where the system has broken down, and that's a damn good place to start if you want to eventually give us the tools to make our gameplay fun again. Create a Survival staff department that focuses on monitoring the health of the gameplay within the survival worlds, which would encompass factions, pvp, and the player driven economy. This is NOT the Game staff department, which are charged with enforcing the server's rule. If a ROLEPLAY department can be justified to monitor and release content for roleplay, a SURVIVAL department can be justified to monitor and release content for the survival worlds.
 
Alj23 said:
The home of the factions plugin should have the best factions gameplay. Period.
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I hear you. I like the idea of having a "Survival Department" dedicated to survival and faction issues.

I don't think it's about "choosing not to tackle it". Creating, testing and balancing something like MassiveMagic or Traits is quite a bit more difficult than the simple things I do, like make the Daily Creeper. I don't know how to do any of that stuff. If you can help out in that arena, trying out for Tech staff might be the way to go.

All I can do is work with what we have and try to stay positive. What are your thoughts on CoK? Certainly, that is a step in the right direction and in the spirit of working with what we have. They made a fun game out of faction stats.
 
Not sure if this is the place to bring this up again, but I think faction embassies (maybe just for the CoK factions?) would help get people more interested in the faction worlds. It would provide a link between these two disparate universes, which might make it easier for RPers to engage with it, and also drive home that these factions are canon.

It doesn't matter if there's a "lore approved" sticker next to your name on the forums. If you're not represented in Regalia, you don't really exist.
 
LeafMC said:
, but I think faction embassies
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I've alwaysed love this idea. To take it a step further I'd love to see high ranking nobles "sponser" PVPers in things, maybe it'd be like a house champion, people would watch IC and such and there would be a title passed around for which house has the greatest champion. Idk, that's what I've always pictureds Silverwind being like if it ever got finnished
 
Metallum_ said:
I've alwaysed love this idea. To take it a step further I'd love to see high ranking nobles "sponser" PVPers in things, maybe it'd be like a house champion, people would watch IC and such and there would be a title passed around for which house has the greatest champion. Idk, that's what I've always pictureds Silverwind being like if it ever got finnished
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Yes! Nobles (or just people with RP influence, could be criminals or merchants too) sponsoring PVP would be great.
 
Metallum_ said:
I've alwaysed love this idea. To take it a step further I'd love to see high ranking nobles "sponser" PVPers in things, maybe it'd be like a house champion, people would watch IC and such and there would be a title passed around for which house has the greatest champion. Idk, that's what I've always pictureds Silverwind being like if it ever got finnished
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The idea is being brought up over and over. The main issue is usually the attitude of "making PvPers useful for roleplayers" or "integrating PvPers in roleplay" but never the other way around. What would a PvPer gain from sponsorship? How will Pvzpers align based on RP and not OOC bias or connections?
 
Lady_Moselberg said:
The idea is being brought up over and over. The main issue is usually the attitude of "making PvPers useful for roleplayers" or "integrating PvPers in roleplay" but never the other way around. What would a PvPer gain from sponsorship? How will Pvzpers align based on RP and not OOC bias or connections?
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That is certainly an obstacle. The world of RP sort of works on imaginary resources, whereas PVP relies on things like god armor, fortifications, and other things that exist tangibly in the game. Are there things that the RP community could offer the PVP community that they'd find valuable?

I suppose embassies could be a reward of sponsorship.
 
Also, Regalian lore seems to imply even the largest factions would be at most functioning city states, compared to Noble houses and their holdings of tens of thousands.

Embassies imply that the crown recognises them as legitimate political factions, and not barbarians mud wrestling over sticks and stones.
 
DrFong said:
I hear you. I like the idea of having a "Survival Department" dedicated to survival and faction issues.
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Then how do we go about getting something like this created, added, and functioning for the players? This isn't for me to answer, I'm not a staff member with knowledge of the inner workings of the team.

DrFong said:
I don't think it's about "choosing not to tackle it". Creating, testing and balancing something like MassiveMagic or Traits is quite a bit more difficult than the simple things I do, like make the Daily Creeper. I don't know how to do any of that stuff. If you can help out in that arena, trying out for Tech staff might be the way to go.
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Then what is it? I'm aware these things are hard to implement successfully. I'd also like to think that certain elements of roleplay and lore are hard to implement, but that hasn't seemed to stop them. The content keeps flowing. I can't apply for Tech staff because I don't know how to code. The age old argument of "just go learn to code and make all the changes yourself" is tired and overused when the argument is lack of manpower between the tech department and the lore department. Two different beast. Everyone agrees on this. Why can't I continue to formulate ideas and hand them off to the staff and have them worked into realization as happens in lore? If there was a Survival department I'd love to work in it. But alas, there is none.

As someone who has ever been in a faction participating in COK, and who is in a faction not currently participating in COK, my outside perspective is that it is a good addition to the server, so long as it is monitored, and changes are made as needed to keep it operating as it was intended. I'm aware that there have been issues with the system brought up in the past, and so long as they are addressed and fixed, there's no problem. As for whether it is satisfying for endgame content, I do not know. What I can say is that as a player of survival factions on MassiveCrafy for 5 years, the way COK has been marketed and advertised to the factions players hasn't drawn any bit of interest of mine. It seems like a poor attempt at giving wars meaning again, by attaching the title of Crown of Hadar to the overall winner. But from what I've seen, this hasn't appeared to give any significant benefits to the faction that wins except some bragging rights. And when people outside survival don't care about COK and even most factions within survival don't lend much significance to the title of Crown of Hadar, the bragging rights aren't worth anything.

The ideal COK system makes every faction currently participating in COK hungry for the crown while it also intices factions not currently participating in COK to join and pursue the crown.
 
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