Implemented Hackusations, Trials & Punishment.

did i quit pvp at the right time lol

 

Pretty much, unless you don't mind being banned without being shown what you've done.

 

Totally agree with the post, we need to have solid evidence for his ban, he got banned way to quickly, it has barely been 3 days since he came back and started to grind his stats, he had only pvp’d for lesser than 2 days...

I agree with the thought of having the “SS” system implemented on Massive, i just see much more pros than cons, even if it is possible to bypass screenshares, it doesn’t hurt for staff to actually screenshare the players before banning them, it just makes much more sense for them to do it to have solid evidence before banning the players.

 

No Marty, as long as the game is keeped open. If they now logg off for example, then sure they can't really deffend themself, that's upon them, but you can't simply remove files in a client that currently is running.

 

Absolutely I don't think you can keep anonymity. I see where you are comming from, but at same time unless anything is being done more people get ''possibly'' wrongfully punished. Plus I hate people being complete ''Bitches'' about it and can't own up to if they made a report, if you belive your evidence is right to whichever player then you gotta own up towards it. Plus It's absolute impossible to appeal or argue a PvP related ban if the ''evidence'' is just being held by staff and keep saying ''Ooooh but we have gatherd evidence for 3 days''. If It's clear evidence of a person cheating then absolutely great punish them and they know what to write in their appeals ones seen what they've been banned for. Incase you get wrongfully punished you can't do anything, staff just expect you to admit to hacking even if you havent done anything wrong. That's allways been the case to any PvP related bans.

Plus I belive strongly that the PvP community itself as a wholle can judge if someone cheater better than most staff. And no that's not meant as an insult towards staff, I simply think It's a better system with more accurate resualt.

 

go check out the pvp council suggestion i made a while ago which 99,999999% of the pvp community agreed on but was turned down for some reason :-)

 

Seems a-okay to me

 

If the client is an external like Vape all it will leave is a few memory strings in a running java client that are constantly being refined by developers and removed

And even then there's simply very few eays for us to access information like that- other servers are able to through their industry connections with developers of Minecraft itself and anticheat developers

 

So you want bans to work the way they do now? How suprising

 

Never said that, just giving info

 

I've been receiving backlash from your entire group for the mere accusation that I was the reporter that got Sirvan banned.

 

More like it would shut us up and you will be right. The problem is all bans are done behind closed doors and no one can fight a ban. They can only just say they did it and ask for forgiveness which will just be denied and then you come back saying "You admitted to it now so you must be hacking". Its a Lose - Lose for the player even if they are not guilty.

If you show the proof then everyone has to get on with it and the banned player no longer has a leg to stand on. Or if the proof isnt there then we lift the ban off said player and they can continue to keep playing.

You and him fought then 2 hours later gets banned. If I remember correctly you were removed once for abusing and going into our bases without our permission. And you claim to be the PvP G0D of the server and know everything and anything about hacks so I wonder why...

 

Honestly, this needs to stop.

 

I dont really understand the need to think hard about this... it seems very simple.

• PVPers need to have a screenshare program like discord. If you do not, then you are presumed guilty should something come up. Discord isnt hard to get, I dont see why thats an issue.
• If you log out between being accused and providing the screenshare, then you are presumed guilty. IIRC @CS_Birb said he can tell the difference between a connection disconnect and a manual disconnect as far as logs are concerned (but i may be misremembering that)
• If you dont want to be known as "that guy" who reported somebody? Then dont do it lol. Thats your prerogative to report them. You have to weigh the outcomes in your mind and make a choice.

Like is it any more complicated than this? Or is there another issue I'm not seeing? I may be misunderstanding this post

 

I’m not a fan of screensharing. Frankly, I’m not comfortable doing it with some random stranger I met on the internet; I’d rather just take the ban. Plus, there’s the issue of ghost clients as winterless has pointed out.

I do think we should share evidence with the accused. A staff YouTube account for this purpose could be set up with unlisted videos. If the recording staff memeber wants to protect their privacy, they can edit a black box over their chat which will do a reasonable enough job protecting identity, in my opinion. As it is, I have no issue with sharing the recordings I have, it’s just up to game policy, and I’m not game staff.

I don’t feel players should have any say on someone being banned, period. That’s just asking for abuse and people brigading people they don’t like.

Finally, I’d like to say that, despite what some people are implying, or outright saying, sirvan’s ban was not in any way winterless deciding he wanted to ban sirvan because he killed him at kit. Evidence was taken on multiple occasions by multiple pvpers in staff.

 

Absolutely. I never can understand the benefit of servers that have public ban forms and ban appeals. However I feel like there should be some way to have a semi-public appeal where you can invite people to vouch for you and provide evidence to your innocence. I agree this system should be improved, it hasnt changed much in the nearly 4 years I've been around. I would argue that the PVP community is considerably more mature than that of 2015.

I mean, the small exception shouldnt be the reason for not doing something. They made bulletproof vests with the full knowledge that you can still get shot in the head. If you dont want to screenshare, I would just say tough toenails. You not being in the mood to screenshare shouldnt be the reason its not implemented as a rule. ily jes dont forget <3

 

Here is what I purpose:
Go through normal ban steps that we have now.
Then let the evidence that is being brought up known to the player (accused) and let them defend themselves and explain what is going on and why.
Then if the evidence is still clear and staff is sure that they are hacking/cheating/breaking any rule, they are banned as normal and posted in a separate forum page run by a bot forum account.
In the case of a video just ask the player to send the video and post it under a Massive youtube account.

Simple easy steps. No one gets flamed since no one knows who is putting out the report.

 

Post the evidince and we will stop flaming until then we have to go off with what we know. That Winterless has already gone after us and tried to use his staff to get one over us (and got removed mind you) and that 4 of our players were banned within a few days of him being reappointed. Seems fishy to me now doesnt it

 

I edited my post a bit to make it better check it out.
But yes I like the idea, but I think a player should be able to defend themselves first before they get banned.

 

My point was I don’t think it’s fair to subject people to a procedure I wouldn’t be comfortable with, and ban them if they refuse. Seems a little hypocritical to me.

 

I agree that evidence should be shown

Speculation, whilst I did fight him 2 hours before he was banned, it does not follow that that single fight was the reason he was banned.

Non-sequitur and honestly not that accurate either, I resigned.

I never claim to be the "PvP God" of the server. Braive, Ieso, and Hardname are all capable of beating me pretty easily at KitPvP and factions.

 

I had nothing to do with three of those bans. Absolutely nothing. I deliberately recused myself from that entire situation because of that very reason.

Staff have taken reports against me pretty seriously in the past, and I have been reviewed by Game staff and Direction multiple times whilst as a player and as a staff member for hacking. You'd have to take that up with them

 

I agree

Screensharing is an incredibly easy platform for doxxing people

 

I mean not really... but sure

 

I personally highly dislike screensharing. To be blunt - there's no real reason to allow people to Snoop thru my PC and files. I do, however, agree that the system could be improved.

 

If we’re using it like that, sure, I have no issue with that. Most HCF servers that do a lot of screensharing will freeze and request a screen share the moment you land a single sketchy hit. But if we’re using it as a last resort way to show innocence, I’m all for it.

 

Extremely incorrect. Remote access != screenshare. Screenshare is like when you use Discord to show your screen. To be clear you are not giving access to your computer or files to another person. They just are able to see what you see and you turn it off once you're finished.

 

bruh, I carried out multiple screenshares, we just require players to go through their minecraft files, if you're that paranoid ensure your desktop and anything you don't want us to look at is cleared. The only way there could be any doxxing is if i literally airdropped u my address.

 

Same principle. I wouldn't allow people to share my screen over discord either. Sensitive information can be saved on my computer that I don't really want spread about. And no, before someone memes, it's not inappropriate content.

 

Once again, I don't feel like you understand whats happening and you are bringing issues in that wouldn't exist. As long as you, the person who controls the screenshare, do not exit Discord or Minecraft and open other windows... nothing else can be seen. So this fear you have is, to put it bluntly, nonexistant in this proposal assuming you don't open up sensitive content, which is 100% on you to not do. Has nothing to do with other people. Perhaps close all unrelated windows? That way nothing is open other than Discord or Minecraft giving you a 0% chance of accidental spreading information.

 

I understand exactly what is happening, Zacatero, and I don't appreciate you implying incompetence. The usage of screensharing is largely irrelevant, like Winter said, since it's not particularly hard to hide hacked clients.