Archived 30% Defensive Buff Discussion

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BenRekt

BenRekt

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As the title suggests, this post is about the 30% buff defenders receive whilst inside their own faction territory. Although a post concerning this "issue" has been brought up and created several times, I believe it has been a while since the 30% Damage Reduction in home faction territory has been brought up, or even discussed. As a PvPer myself, the 30% buff defenders receive in their own faction territory has always been over powered, discouraging raiding, as well as making anyone who is remotely good at running or healing close to invincible. I know I am not the only person who feels with way. After many other discussions with other active PvPers on Massive, I believe most experienced veterans believe the 30% Buff is harmful to the PvP community, as it allows less skilled players to triumph over people who are much more skilled than them, which in my opinion, should rarely ever be the case.

I would like to go back on what the title says, and state that I am not looking for a removal, not at all, only a reduction, to around 10-15%. Or have it so the buff is only applies when Pacifist is true, allowing non-PvPers a better chance at escaping their attackers. This will allow a slight defensive buff, but not something as overpowered as taking away nearly 1/3rd of the damage dealt from an opponent.

Just to summarize:

Why I believe the 30% buff requires a reduction

  • Discourages raiding
  • Creates imbalance of skill
  • Encourages players to faction hop to gain the buff
  • Spark point for flame, and hurts community - "Only fighting with the buff"
  • (Will add more points as thread is discussed)
I would like to fully re-iterate, this is mostly my opinion, but this opinion is very well shared by a majority of veteran (and many "non-veteran" players) from the MassiveCraft PvP community. This being said, the staff have always handled the server in an amazing manner, and this thread is to be free of flame or I will have it locked.

Just going to quickly tag people I believe can share their opinion on the subject:
@spoonly @Kidmodo @WU_Walrus @FubeTheMangler @ZIHAMMER1411 @davidn2012 @Wannag @jquaile @thor5648 @Jay Jay @kevencolis @Assembly123 @Killingking777 @Joshy54100 @Waminer @Yoloorange @wafflecash @Asmodeus35 @MazzerDK @MagicalWetToast @YankeeGiant8013 @qgmk

I am also going to ask that if you strongly agree with my opinion as well, that you change your status to this:
http://forums.massivecraft.com/forums/feature-idea-discussion.29/create-thread
In hopes of getting more opinions and feedback.
 
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Mecharic said:
Just to remind people, my statement was as a mimic of every PvPer ever saying "Just surrender" when people complain about being raided. So basically I was telling everyone to "get over it" just like PvPers tell us peaceable folk to surrender. A pretty decent part of me hopes the administration agrees with me, since PvPers shouldn't be able to raid people with impudence imo. Then the other part of me wants PvP to survive because I like PvP just not the whole "shit, there went my last god-sword/axe" part lol
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OK so really there has been no idea as to how to compromise just to restate and start this anew, the two ideas are "just surrender" and "Get over it" let's run this through again
 
If someone ever asks me what the Massivecraft community is like, this will be one of the first threads I'll direct them too.

"And if you look to your right, you'll see the weekly complaint thread from the PvP community. Many of these will be created as you spend more of your time on Massivecraft. PvPers often partake in many of our scheduled activities including: arguing with everyone; complaining about things or people they don't like; and all in all, not playing nicely with their fellow Massivecrafters.
Remember: Cows go 'Moo', Roleplayers go 'read the lore!', and PvPers go 'PvP is unbalanced!'"
 
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Laach said:
If someone ever asks me what the Massivecraft community is like, this will be one of the first threads I'll direct them too.

"And if you look to your right, you'll see the weekly complaint thread from the PvP community. Many of these will be created as you spend more of your time on Massivecraft. PvPers often partake in many of our scheduled activities including: arguing with everyone; complaining about things or people they don't like; and all in all, not playing nicely with their fellow Massivecrafters.
Remember: Cows go 'Moo', Roleplayers go 'read the lore!', and PvPers go 'PvP is unbalanced!'"
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Take your flame the hell off this thread now. But, in all honesty, PVP is unbalanced now.
 
Laach said:
If someone ever asks me what the Massivecraft community is like, this will be one of the first threads I'll direct them too.

"And if you look to your right, you'll see the weekly complaint thread from the PvP community. Many of these will be created as you spend more of your time on Massivecraft. PvPers often partake in many of our scheduled activities including: arguing with everyone; complaining about things or people they don't like; and all in all, not playing nicely with their fellow Massivecrafters.
Remember: Cows go 'Moo', Roleplayers go 'read the lore!', and PvPers go 'PvP is unbalanced!'"
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Not only is this offensive and disrespectful to your fellow players, you basically have no clue what you are talking about, as you do not spend your time actually learning about PvP or experiencing it. If you want to flame about PvPers complaining about unbalances in PvP, maybe you should go make your own post, and probably go grow-up a tad bit.

(Tagging staff to clear this flame)
@Ha5h @Gethelp
 
BenAlex144 said:
Not only is this offensive and disrespectful to your fellow players, you basically have no clue what you are talking about, as you do not spend your time actually learning about PvP or experiencing it. If you want to flame about PvPers complaining about unbalances in PvP, maybe you should go make your own post, and probably go grow-up a tad bit.
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What's the point in defending my own actions when everyone considers me guilty until proven innocent? Sure, I like playing as the bad guy, but there's no fun in making it too easy for me.
 
Tokugawryuu said:
There's one small flaw in this idea. With the buff, no one in their right mind would ever choose to fight on neutral ground. I mean, why would you willingly give up an overwhelming advantage?
That being said, a pacifist system would just work just fine, with you losing the buff when pacifist true is lost. This allows people a few more hits to get inside while it balances the PvP system, not giving people an overwhelming advantage and bypassing the need for a neutral arena
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I didn't mean organise some sort of battle at aqua or something. From my experience most battles between large factions are proxy battles, faction A attacks faction B, faction C defends faction B because they're at war with faction A and faction B is just left there picking their nose while a bunch of McMMO grinders with god armour run rampant. With the buff faction B can actually do something and faction C can interfere with faction A without needing to invade them and fight against the buff.
 
Laach said:
If someone ever asks me what the Massivecraft community is like, this will be one of the first threads I'll direct them too.

"And if you look to your right, you'll see the weekly complaint thread from the PvP community. Many of these will be created as you spend more of your time on Massivecraft. PvPers often partake in many of our scheduled activities including: arguing with everyone; complaining about things or people they don't like; and all in all, not playing nicely with their fellow Massivecrafters.
Remember: Cows go 'Moo', Roleplayers go 'read the lore!', and PvPers go 'PvP is unbalanced!'"
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People like you saying things like this is the exact reason PvPers hate RPers so much.
 
Laach said:
If someone ever asks me what the Massivecraft community is like, this will be one of the first threads I'll direct them too.

"And if you look to your right, you'll see the weekly complaint thread from the PvP community. Many of these will be created as you spend more of your time on Massivecraft. PvPers often partake in many of our scheduled activities including: arguing with everyone; complaining about things or people they don't like; and all in all, not playing nicely with their fellow Massivecrafters.
Remember: Cows go 'Moo', Roleplayers go 'read the lore!', and PvPers go 'PvP is unbalanced!'"
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"As a cow, I find this post offensive!" - Madam Moo

But seriously, people, get over it. What Laach said is almost literally true. If an entire month goes by without someone from the RP or PvP communities making a post bitching about the way MassiveCraft works I will eat my old shoes -_-
 
And just a last word before this thread gets locked (which it really should be at this point) PvP will always be unbalanced because some people are walking armies while others are decidedly less dangerous. You'd need to remove all mcMMO and traits, turning the game back to pure vanilla, to perfectly balance PvP.
 
Mecharic said:
And just a last word before this thread gets locked (which it really should be at this point) PvP will always be unbalanced because some people are walking armies while others are decidedly less dangerous. You'd need to remove all mcMMO and traits, turning the game back to pure vanilla, to perfectly balance PvP.
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To be totally honest, I would be all for removing traits and McMMO completely, but no point in even trying to do that.
 
Mecharic said:
"As a cow, I find this post offensive!" - Madam Moo

But seriously, people, get over it. What Laach said is almost literally true. If an entire month goes by without someone from the RP or PvP communities making a post bitching about the way MassiveCraft works I will eat my old shoes -_-
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c'mon everyone! let's do this! i want to se mecharic eating his old shoes!
 
Asmodeus35 said:
People like you saying things like this is the exact reason PvPers hate RPers so much.
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That's quite the assumption you're making... are you sure thats true? Lots of my friends on massive are role-players. If you/your faction dont like role-players don't make an assumption that all PvP'ers hate Role-players...
 
BenAlex144 said:
@Joshy54100 Victorious!!!
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But are you really victorious? Will this change bring a better PvP experience, or will it cause more problems which you will inevitably fret about in the near future?
(Don't get your hopes up kid. Bad things happen to people who get too comfortable with Massivecraft's changes.)
 
Laach said:
But are you really victorious? Will this change bring a better PvP experience, or will it cause more problems which you will inevitably fret about in the near future?
(Don't get your hopes up kid. Bad things happen to people who get too comfortable with Massivecraft's changes.)
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Considering the fact that I have almost never had the 30% buff I'm quite comfortable at the moment. Thanks for your concerns, but I got exactly what I wanted.
 
Speaking from purely personal experience here, but every time I've been raided, the 30% defense buff has been about as useful as a sheet of tissue paper. I still get almost instantly killed by god-armored pvpers. As a result, I have nothing against removing the buff to make high level pvp more enjoyable. It won't benefit me, but then again it doesn't really harm me either as a good axe blow to the back of the head seems to kill me regardless of my "home field advantage". Speaking of home field advantage, here's a message to anyone who claims that even without the buff factions still have a large advantage. You have obviously been in none of the faction's I've been in, considering for me the first 10 minutes after a raid starts are usually filled with confused, angry noobs and members running to their deaths and ignoring whatever orders I give them. Yeah, we sure got a home field advantage when half of our online members decide that engaging a god armored pvper with a stick and half a leather boot is a good idea.
 
favoured said:
Speaking from purely personal experience here, but every time I've been raided, the 30% defense buff has been about as useful as a sheet of tissue paper. I still get almost instantly killed by god-armored pvpers. As a result, I have nothing against removing the buff to make high level pvp more enjoyable. It won't benefit me, but then again it doesn't really harm me either as a good axe blow to the back of the head seems to kill me regardless of my "home field advantage". Speaking of home field advantage, here's a message to anyone who claims that even without the buff factions still have a large advantage. You have obviously been in none of the faction's I've been in, considering for me the first 10 minutes after a raid starts are usually filled with confused, angry noobs and members running to their deaths and ignoring whatever orders I give them. Yeah, we sure got a home field advantage when half of our online members decide that engaging a god armored pvper with a stick and half a leather boot is a good idea.
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I agree, there's not really any advantage when you aren't prepared for it. I often end up getting killed constantly by PvPers when my faction is raided. Mostly because I left my PvP gear in a different location, but secondly because I just want to add the finishing touches to my dang house and they keep using archery to rudely knock me off of it. It was the literal Minecraft equivalent of knocking over my sand castle multiple times.
 
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