Archived Things That I(we) Think Need Fixing

[Aeyris]

Hey,

Below are some things that need to be addressed. I have collaborated with many people new and veteran on massive.

Movement
- Potions/Pearls are broken Potting and pearls are just an easy thing to point out that is wrong.

- Hit detection Please find a way to not make this feel like we are fighting in soup.

Damage
- Traits are a cool idea but the PVP geared traits just make things broken - so i suggest maybe a compromise to find a happy medium - they also make the game really buggy is certain situations like feeding.

- Mcmmo Fishing was fixed and that is right - however, this has not followed to other traits - like unarmed (among other traits) where anyone with a somewhat high level can disarm like every second shot. Furthermore, for anyone who wants to join the server and fight - they pretty much need to spend dozens hours on the server just getting their axe/sword level up just to even have a chance at competing with damage, while that time should be spent making armour and weapons to overthrow the elite class on Massive.

- Traits + Strength + mcmmo this combined break pvp (one way or another the damage has to be fixed) you should not have worry about being three shot in full god armour.

Administration
- Hacking Massive needs better anti-cheat - the amount of ghost cringe clients circulating the upper echelon of factions is a definite failure of the current anti-cheat system. Hacking should not be a go to in order to fight actual good pvpers (I understand some of you are legit) - and the fact that this volume of cheating goes unanswered is appalling. Also we need more Screen Shares from admins.

All of this has led to a broken pvp system that has created a superb example of elitism, that make it hard for anyone else to stay on this server. I think a lot of these things I have pointed out will help fix each other if they are fixed.

I write this out of love for massive - Please I urge the idling in the PvP sector to be addressed to make this server more competitive and fun for everyone.

Cheers fam,

Aeyris

Leader of the most cringe faction on the server (Night Raid)

P.S Constructive comments only

 

[Aeyris]

I'm aware that many things here is on the Admin List of things - The validity of this hasn't changed - We need effective action now.

 

[Gabauchi]

pvp'ers are elites because of the countless hours they put into becoming that way. the reason it's set up so that you need to spend a lot of time training in order to become a pvper is to encourage people to play frequently, and to put in some effort in order to receive gain. Otherwise the server would be no different than that of a minigame.

another thing is that traits are very balanced, in that there exist both offensive and defensive traits. if you're getting threeshot, I would suggest getting something like healthboost 2, or acquiring some gapples/resistance potions.

As far as hacking goes, I have only ever really seen one actual moment of hacking, and it wasn't pvp oriented at all. sometimes people really are that good. I think I saw thortuna beat a pvper without using any armor.

also as a footnote, you should elaborate a bit more on your points, as well as give some examples. I don't really understand some of the points you're making.

 

[Aeyris]

pvp'ers are elites because of the countless hours they put into becoming that way. the reason it's set up so that you need to spend a lot of time training in order to become a pvper is to encourage people to play frequently, and to put in some effort in order to receive gain. Otherwise the server would be no different than that of a minigame.

another thing is that traits are very balanced, in that there exist both offensive and defensive traits. if you're getting threeshot, I would suggest getting something like healthboost 2, or acquiring some gapples/resistance potions.

As far as hacking goes, I have only ever really seen one actual moment of hacking, and it wasn't pvp oriented at all. sometimes people really are that good. I think I saw thortuna beat a pvper without using any armor.

also as a footnote, you should elaborate a bit more on your points, as well as give some examples. I don't really understand some of the points you're making.

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I would disagree and say many pvpers that are good on massive are good because of the system - also poeple play on servers that are fun not ones that are hard to get a footing in. after all its a block game not real life. And Traits are not balanced - especially when combined with Strength and Mcmmo those extra 4 hearts or axe res dont do much

 

[Rinozu]

pvp'ers are elites because of the countless hours they put into becoming that way. the reason it's set up so that you need to spend a lot of time training in order to become a pvper is to encourage people to play frequently, and to put in some effort in order to receive gain. Otherwise the server would be no different than that of a minigame.

another thing is that traits are very balanced, in that there exist both offensive and defensive traits. if you're getting threeshot, I would suggest getting something like healthboost 2, or acquiring some gapples/resistance potions.

As far as hacking goes, I have only ever really seen one actual moment of hacking, and it wasn't pvp oriented at all. sometimes people really are that good. I think I saw thortuna beat a pvper without using any armor.

also as a footnote, you should elaborate a bit more on your points, as well as give some examples. I don't really understand some of the points you're making.

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first of all if you had spent any time on a real pvp server then you would know that the time people put into just vanilla Minecraft pvp is a lot I know some people who just do 1v1s on practice servers all day and i say real pvp server because massive craft pvp is an unbalanced mess that gives advantage to people with the best stats and not the most skill

second people on this server have no idea what a real hacker looks like when you go into the realm of ghost clients it becomes harder and harder to differentiate from good players and cheaters which is why an ss system is needed

lastly he is talking about the combined power of damage traits high mcmmo and an un-nerfed strength 2 potions that can 3 tap people even with a full tank build

 

[Gabauchi]

first of all if you had spent any time on a real pvp server then you would know that the time people put into just vanilla Minecraft pvp is a lot I know some people who just do 1v1s on practice servers all day and i say real pvp server because massive craft pvp is an unbalanced mess that gives advantage to people with the best stats and not the most skill

second people on this server have no idea what a real hacker looks like when you go into the realm of ghost clients it becomes harder and harder to differentiate from good players and cheaters which is why an ss system is needed

lastly he is talking about the combined power of damage traits high mcmmo and an un-nerfed strength 2 potions that can 3 tap people even with a full tank build

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all good points but you've yet to address my point on dedication.

 

[Aeyris]

all good points but you've yet to address my point on dedication.

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Dedication to what the server? - Yes hard work be rewarded, but from respect and supporting of other players - however your "dedication" should not be based from a system that enables the exploitation of new players and those who bend a complicated server such as massive.

 

[Gabauchi]

Dedication to what the server? - Yes hard work be rewarded, but from respect and supporting of other players - however your "dedication" should not be based from a system that enables the exploitation of new players and those who bend a complicated server such as massive.

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please elaborate on how perceived effort and respect and support are related in this scenario.

 

[Aeyris]

please elaborate on how perceived effort and respect and support are related in this scenario.

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Because dedication is an effort, and dedication results in respect and in respect you have the opportunity to support. finally, when you support (by changing the server) it makes it a better place for everyone. I believe it it very related

If that confused you read over it 100 times

 

[Zacatero]

- Potions/Pearls are broken Potting and pearls are just an easy thing to point out that is wrong

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Can you elaborate on this?

 

[65jes89]

Can you elaborate on this?

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Basically the mechanics behind these items' trajectories while in the air were changed in 1.9, and they really suck now. For example, sometimes if you jump and throw a pearl, the pearl will land literally 5 blocks in front of you regardless of where it logically should go, and would go in 1.8. Same type of thing with potions.

I think this could technically be fixed with a plugin to override these behaviors, however it would most likely be extremely complicated, and probably just make the problem worse.

 

[65jes89]

Hit detection Please find a way to not make this feel like we are fighting in soup.

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A lot of this is from 1.9/1.10 changes in combat and massive's switch back. Hit registration in minecraft in general has gotten worse since 1.6, and I'm not altogether sure if it's possible to fix. If you use a 1.8.x minecraft client, however, it does help a little bit.

Traits are a cool idea but the PVP geared traits just make things broken - so i suggest maybe a compromise to find a happy medium - they also make the game really buggy is certain situations like feeding.

- Mcmmo Fishing was fixed and that is right - however, this has not followed to other traits - like unarmed (among other traits) where anyone with a somewhat high level can disarm like every second shot. Furthermore, for anyone who wants to join the server and fight - they pretty much need to spend dozens hours on the server just getting their axe/sword level up just to even have a chance at competing with damage, while that time should be spent making armour and weapons to overthrow the elite class on Massive.

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Personally I think traits should be converted to micro-values and mcmmo should be made not to affect combat at all for a multitude of reasons. I could write literally thousands of words on this, but I'm on my phone and don't want to xP

Hacking Massive needs better anti-cheat - the amount of ghost cringe clients circulating the upper echelon of factions is a definite failure of the current anti-cheat system. Hacking should not be a go to in order to fight actual good pvpers (I understand some of you are legit) - and the fact that this volume of cheating goes unanswered is appalling. Also we need more Screen Shares from admins.

Click to shrink...

Honestly I don't think massive has a huge problem with hackers. I can really only think of one blatant hacker who isn't banned, and hos client is honestly so crappy he's not really difficult to kill. He'll get banned pretty soon anyways once someone decides to actually record him. The problem with screen shares is that you really have to know what you're doing. It's not exactly difficult to find some shitty client you downloaded of the Internet for free, but it gets kinda difficult from there. The issue with an anticheat is that there really is no perfect anticheat. Take badlion's gcheat for example. It's supposed to be so "prefect" that the moderators on badlion are literally now allowed to ban for hacks, they have to let only gcheat auto-ban hackers. Yet still, there have been so many documented cases of people being banned from gcheat and then proving they weren't hacking it's not funny. Massive's last testing with an anticheat was an absolute disaster, and I don't think it'll really get much better from there if you want an anticheat that will catch people who aren't blatant.

All-in-all I agree with all of your suggestions, however I think only the traits/mcmmo/balancing one is really very practical to implement.

 

[TheOverseer__]

Traits and powerful MCMMO are the reason I stay with massive. I think it's great that people who spend time working towards a certain skill get advantages for doing so. I think it's great that Mastering Vanilla PVP does not equate directly to being successful on massive. You just HAVE to put the time in ON massive.

I think all the extra things in the mix make MASSIVEcraft a whole other give than MINEcraft, and I honestly think the massive is better....

Traits causes you to need to think about more complexities in battle. There are more strategies then just clicking the fastest and having decent aim. Having un-nerfed potions means that players who put the effort into either buying or farming pot materials have advantages, rightfully so! Having mcmmo means that you gotta have your rocky balboa moment where you jumped off a cliff 5000 times to get that 20% dodge chance. Thats how that movie went right?

Many of those "elites" post videos of their PvP on youtube, wouldn't you see their hacked clients in those videos? I've never used one before so I wouldn't know.

 

[65jes89]

Traits and powerful MCMMO are the reason I stay with massive. I think it's great that people who spend time working towards a certain skill get advantages for doing so. I think it's great that Mastering Vanilla PVP does not equate directly to being successful on massive. You just HAVE to put the time in ON massive.

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All that does is drive new pvpers away from massive.

Traits causes you to need to think about more complexities in battle

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You realize every pvper uses a slight variation of the same trait build right?... It's not exactly a ton of strategic thought.

There are more strategies then just clicking the fastest and having decent aim.

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You're right, there's w-tapping, strafing, decent pot management, etc. However those are all vanilla minecraft tactics... It doesn't take a whole lot of strategic thought to use skullsplitter at the right time and grinding axes does nothing but drive away new players.

Many of those "elites" post videos of their PvP on youtube, wouldn't you see their hacked clients in those videos? I've never used one before so I wouldn't know.

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I agree with the idea here, but not really the argument. The idea of a ghost client is that it is invisible, hence the ghost.

 

[Aeyris]

Who ever votes no - please elaborate.

 

[TheOverseer__]

The problem with the logic that McMMO discourages new PvPers is that you assume that all PvPers who join the server will be fighting Sevak tomorrow. There are 14 people on the McMMO skill scoreboard with power levels under 2000 and "PvP" in their name. Chances are any of those people are interested in PvP and would be a fair match for a brand new player.

I have 2 members in my faction who just started recently who likes PvP too, and we find plenty of opportunities for combat even though they aren't out 1v1ing morby.

The fact is massivecraft is an RPG based server. It isn't designed to log in one day and be #1 the next day. Sure, there are broken things, but removal or complete nerfs of McMMO or Traits are not the answer to that.

 

[Zacatero]

Well this runs into the wall weve had before with this topic

Favor the new players who dont want to grind/level mcmmo. Or favor the veterens who have spent time and effort

 

[Aeyris]

Then what is the awnser? RPG should be competitive - and that doesn't mean just for new players

 

[Zacatero]

Then what is the awnser? RPG should be competitive - and that doesn't mean just for new players

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I think it was @Jackmo_Jones who said it (correct me if im wrong) but it was something along the lines of

"This is an mcmmo server and most new people would know that upon joining"

You arent going to be as skilled as a veteran player right when u start and nor should you be in my opinion. Work for it. Plus the stats dont have a huge impact anyway

Everything after level 1000 on all stats it doesnt buff you after that. Level 1000 swords and level 9000 swords mean the same thing. And its not incredibly difficult to get to 1k

 

[Aeyris]

I mean I'm not totally against mcmmo - but i think it needs a nerf . Like Jes said it should be a micro buff. And our margumentment was when mcmmo + plus strength + traits are combined.

 

[Aeyris]

Well this runs into the wall weve had before with this topic

Favor the new players who dont want to grind/level mcmmo. Or favor the veterens who have spent time and effort

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It doesn't have to be either - Veterans will be richer, but new players will have a more level playing field

 

[Rinozu]

Im not saying i like the way pvp is on the server at all. But THIS



helps nothing and isnt productive and is just stupid. Why say this? Insulting the server doesnt sound to me like u want to help it. After reading that its pretty clear that if thats the way u feel Massive can do without you

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the fact is i like massive as a server and i don't want to leave but the pvp on this server gives me cancer and if the staff aren't willing to improve then i don't want to be here

 

[Zacatero]

the fact is i like massive as a server and i don't want to leave but the pvp on this server gives me cancer and if the staff aren't willing to improve then i don't want to be here

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The staff are more than willing to improve but what is your suggestion?

And no massive cannot go back to 1.8

 

[leichendame]

tf is a ghost client

 

[Zacatero]

tf is a ghost client

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From context, it appears that it's a Hacked Client that looks just like normal. So you can still record and it won't be suspicious

 

[Rinozu]

tf is a ghost client

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Its like a hack client that that is harder to find in a ss and is less obvious when in game

 

[Zacatero]

Massivecraft has a responsibility beyond our server and thats to keep the plugins like factions updated. And yes you can connect with 1.8 but the server runs 1.10. Maybe @Cayorion or @MonMarty might know more about that.

 

[Aeyris]

Can we get some admin input on here - I know you guys have taken steps...

 

[Aespair]

●Commentary Removed - thread cleanup●

The suggestions themselves aren't exactly suggestions. You are stating things you see as problems and not listing possible solutions for them.

 

[Jackmo_Jones]

I think it was @Jackmo_Jones who said it (correct me if im wrong) but it was something along the lines of

"This is an mcmmo server and most new people would know that upon joining"

You arent going to be as skilled as a veteran player right when u start and nor should you be in my opinion. Work for it. Plus the stats dont have a huge impact anyway

Everything after level 1000 on all stats it doesnt buff you after that. Level 1000 swords and level 9000 swords mean the same thing. And its not incredibly difficult to get to 1k

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Yeah, that was me.

As far as mcmmo stats making much of a difference it really doesn't. Take me for example beast stats but terrible at PvP. If you're better at PvP than your opponent you will win simple as that. My stats have never helped me win a fight I wouldn't have otherwise.

As far as the changes well two things to say about that. First this game unlike others constantly goes through changes because of the updates and if this bothers you like it did me do what I did and move on there's plenty of other games to play. As far as the approach Massive has been taking by altering the updates and trying to keep that 1.8 feeling I personally feel that should stop and they should just move to 1.10 mechanics. Just seems like any time they try to fix one thing it breaks 10 other things and I don't think that would happen if the changes were more in sync with the updates.

Anyway my opinion means very little these days sooo *goes back to playing Black Ops 3*

 

[Rinozu]

The staff are more than willing to improve but what is your suggestion?

And no massive cannot go back to 1.8

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if bungee cord can let people connect to massive in 1.8 then they can change the server so that it is hosted in 1.8

 

[Rinozu]

Massivecraft has a responsibility beyond our server and thats to keep the plugins like factions updated. And yes you can connect with 1.8 but the server runs 1.10. Maybe @Cayorion or @MonMarty might know more about that.

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yes they may be the devs of the factions plugin but you need to balance this out what is more important the quality of your server of the wellbeing of other servers and if they are really devoted to it then they could just release the update for the plugin without changing thair server

 

[Winterless]

"3 shotting" is a myth. It does not happen, at least not in recent memory. As for traits, I don't really understand how that makes PvP broken or glitchy. Since the removal of HarmStrike and ArmorpenStrike and Absorption2 and the subsequent balances thereafter, Traits doesn't really make anything glitchy. I would also like clarification as to what is broken with pearls and pots.

 

[Winterless]

first of all if you had spent any time on a real pvp server then you would know that the time people put into just vanilla Minecraft pvp is a lot I know some people who just do 1v1s on practice servers all day and i say real pvp server because massive craft pvp is an unbalanced mess that gives advantage to people with the best stats and not the most skill

second people on this server have no idea what a real hacker looks like when you go into the realm of ghost clients it becomes harder and harder to differentiate from good players and cheaters which is why an ss system is needed

lastly he is talking about the combined power of damage traits high mcmmo and an un-nerfed strength 2 potions that can 3 tap people even with a full tank build

Click to shrink...

The server isn't about who has the highest stats. Fight any PvPers on factions that get a high amount of kills on the kit server and you'll figure out for yourself why they get so many kills, and it isn't for stats, I guarantee it.

 

[celticwitch]

@Staff - I think you guys should vaporize the flame and leave relevant posts behind.

-------------

Rightio guys. I am not a great player nor am I any better at PVP, I don't even know much about it.
Time and dedication is what drives people to stay and become the best they can- it is honestly quite daunting to go into any pvp related situation because we all just know (new players) that we'll be smashed to bits. The higher up players will basically burn us if we don't give time to the game.

We need a middle ground for PVP and make it so there is some type of balance for all players. I have seen shoot tons of new players (including myself) have a spit fire in their brains because they do not understand how traits simply work- we need a more straight forward way of entertaining ourselves in PVP that doesn't include brain aneurysms in the process.

Can anyone help expand on this concept?

 

[celticwitch]

@Thortuna @MonMarty @Cayorion

 

[Winterless]

I'm also not entirely sure HOW stats could affect PvP. Once you get to 1k for most PvP-related traits, it caps anyway (especially since they capped armor damage at 1000). 1000 in a stat like Axes or Acrobatics isn't hard, and so I don't really even understand your argument about how stats>skill on Massive.

 

[Tokuu]

●Commentary Removed - Keeping thread on topic●

But back on topic with this thread. It takes minimal effort to get to 1k axes / acro and 600 unarmed. The exp you get helps you get more God weapons and armour which are necessary for PvP. Every new member who's joined Raptum has put in the effort to up their stats, because we make them feel welcome into a community. Yes, pearls and potions need to be fixed, I completely agree. And the hit registration, especially in kit PvP, is trash sometimes. You need to hit where someone was not where someone is, and that's utterly garbage. So I agree somewhat, about the potions and pearls and hit registration. But McMMO isn't that hard to cap out, and past 1k stats are irrelevant now. Honestly, you can grind to 1k in a day, easily. A few days for the relevant stats and you're good to go

 

[TheOverseer__]

I played a little bit of Vanilla with my wife a few nights ago and we were struck by how different the 1.10 combat system is than massive. It is valuable to say that the game has been updated and we should roll with the updates rather than fight against them. Minecraft has constantly been re-inventing itself and that is part of what makes it so great! Why battle against the thing that made Minecraft great to begin with?

Maybe if we focused less on making sure that we can still spam click our way to victory and all of the wonkiness that caused with the damage, they could work more on stuff like hit registration and pearl/pot trajectories.

 

[Omnomivore]

Keep on topic and stop flaming each other or I will lock this thread.