Archived S C R E E N S H A R I N G

[B0W]

What is screensharing?

Screensharing is where a moderator or admin freezes a player and then uses a program to see the screen of a player who could be using a client modification to enhance their PvP "skill". The moderator/admin will then proceed to go through a series actions that either the player or the op will carry out in order to deduce whether the player is using a "hack" or not (the methods used may depend, as clients have recently become harder and harder to find).

Why????

Ever since the introduction of ghost clients a couple years back, the clicker boy """"community""" has never been the same. It is getting harder and harder to tell if someone is hacking or not, and in most cases, it is no longer as simple as going "oh well he's using ff, lets ban him".
PvP servers have since adopted measures in order to prevent the epidemic hacking that has spread across the entire game. Anticheats have been developed, but overtime, they have become more and more ineffective, as clients have tended to bypass them even after updates (and we're talking about GOOD anticheats here).
Many pvps servers, such as hcf ones, have thus opted to use screensharing as a means to find cheaters, and ever since, It has mostly been a successful endevour. Massivecraft is therefor behind in this regard. The failure to introduce screensharing has made it far harder to truly find out who is cheating and who isn't, which leaves many players who may be using client modifications to continue playing, and those who may have been playing legit to get banned (potentially )

Pros to adding a screensharing:

-Makes it far easier to discern between cheater and legit players.
-It should hopefully clean up the server a little bit in the Survival World.
-The fact that the Massivecraft digger clicker dan community is small means that it should not drain too much time on a moderator's time, as opposed to an all out HCF PvP server.
-It is not very hard to screenshare, and in most cases shouldn't take long considering most Massivecraft players wont have the links to buy well hidden ghost clients.

Potential Issues and response:

-Surely some players may be screenshared far more than others, and be a waste of their time, even if they're legit.

This issue can be averted very easily, although I do not think that Massivecraft would implement it, which would be to introduce a plugin similar to HCF in which instances where a player may reach near impossible CPS limits, or may be no KBing, will be noticed and then displayed on the moderators chat, although this would certainely have to only be limited to PvP moderators to not ruin RP stuff or w ever.
If not, it doesn't matter too much tbh, legit players tend to get "very excited" when they get ssed, and cheaters get scared.

Interrupting fights?

SSes should mostly only occur during a fight if the cheater is obvious, other then that, save it until after, its not really a big deal with the broken economy, but thats for another time...

Privacy?

Shouldn't be a big deal with responsible moderators. SSing has mostly gone on without falt in this respect.

 

[Typhenon]

Yes but to be fair video evidence doesn't prevent them either it just helps catch them. Unless I misunderstood what you meant.

Click to shrink...

See that's the problem why is video evidence the only way to get a hacker banned? Not everyone can record, and even if they can it takes staff atleast a month to determine if the footage is hacks or not and in that time nothing is done about them they're just left to have an unfair advantage with no punishment

 

[__Kitsune__]

@CptSilvyrall @Typhenon I don't PVP, so this might be incorrect, but wouldn't it be harder to tell if someone's hacking by someone's recording? Wouldn't screen sharing be easier, and quicker to determine if there's a hacker? With a recording you only get a view from an outside source, who knows the suspected hacker might just have shit internet and is lagging all over the place. With screen sharing, it seems like you see if they're hacking from the suspected person's point of view, and so then you're sure they are hacking. The current system sees like it's, well, shit.

 

[Viscar]

@CptSilvyrall @Typhenon I don't PVP, so this might be incorrect, but wouldn't it be harder to tell if someone's hacking by someone's recording? Wouldn't screen sharing be easier, and quicker to determine if there's a hacker? With a recording you only get a view from an outside source, who knows the suspected hacker might just have shit internet and is lagging all over the place. With screen sharing, it seems like you see if they're hacking from the suspected person's point of view, and so then you're sure they are hacking. The current system sees like it's, well, shit.

Click to shrink...

That's the point

 

[Typhenon]

@CptSilvyrall @Typhenon I don't PVP, so this might be incorrect, but wouldn't it be harder to tell if someone's hacking by someone's recording? Wouldn't screen sharing be easier, and quicker to determine if there's a hacker? With a recording you only get a view from an outside source, who knows the suspected hacker might just have shit internet and is lagging all over the place. With screen sharing, it seems like you see if they're hacking from the suspected person's point of view, and so then you're sure they are hacking. The current system sees like it's, well, shit.

Click to shrink...

Yeah that's exactly what we're trying to say, it's very hard to prove someones hacking from just a video, especially on massive where it's 24/7 laggy so someone looking sketchy could just be denied saying it was lag. With screensharing it'd be faster and easier

 

[Celeras]

Hm when I first read this I thought it was something like mods being able to see your screen IN GAME and I thought ok no big deal. But you're saying I'd have to download some software, install it, and then let them root around in my files?

Yeah that's gonna be a big hell no from me. Not that I don't trust the mods but... that's way too invasive.

Really the best and least invasive way to prevent hacked clients/ banned mods is for Massivecraft to have its own custom launcher/mod pack that checks what mods you have installed.

 

[Viscar]

Hm when I first read this I thought it was something like mods being able to see your screen IN GAME and I thought ok no big deal. But you're saying I'd have to download some software, install it, and then let them root around in my files?

Yeah that's gonna be a big hell no from me. Not that I don't trust the mods but... that's way too invasive.

Really the best and least invasive way to prevent hacked clients/ banned mods is for Massivecraft to have its own custom launcher that checks what mods you have installed.

Click to shrink...

That's not what they said. I suggest reading some of the above posts explaining it again.

 

[CptSilvyrall]

@CptSilvyrall @Typhenon I don't PVP, so this might be incorrect, but wouldn't it be harder to tell if someone's hacking by someone's recording? Wouldn't screen sharing be easier, and quicker to determine if there's a hacker? With a recording you only get a view from an outside source, who knows the suspected hacker might just have shit internet and is lagging all over the place. With screen sharing, it seems like you see if they're hacking from the suspected person's point of view, and so then you're sure they are hacking. The current system sees like it's, well, shit.

Click to shrink...

Alright, alright, IF it is decided by them not me that they should do something like this, my suggestion is not to install screensharing because something similar already exists in regular minecraft.

1. The player reports the hacker to the staff members.
2. The staff member goes into spectator mode and /tps to the suspected player.
3. While in spectator mode they punch the accused player so they can watch from the player's level of view.

Pros to this:

1. They do not have to download anything else serverside as this can be done in vanilla minecraft.
2. It is less invasive as it does not let them see the player's GUI (Their hotbar or if they've pushed F3 etc.)
3. The hacker would not know they are there letting the moderator watch what they are doing without disturbances. (Unless they log off)

But the cons..

1. Because you can't see their GUI you won't know right away if they are hacking.
2. You may not be able to see the same direction the player is looking.(You might always be looking North? I'm not entirely sure.)

 

[Celeras]

That's not what they said. I suggest reading some of the above posts explaining it again.

Click to shrink...

I think you've understood the concept. All they have to do if they see a hacker is freeze them for a bit and go through some steps which take something from 5-10 minutes to see if they are hacking by checking the client and relevant folders(maybe even shorter). If nothing's found, the person is let go and they can continue playing, if not, they are banned. It's a relatively short process, it's not like you're watching them 24/7 lel

Click to shrink...

In order to check my client and 'relevant folders' I would have to install something like Teamviewer on my PC and then show them or allow them to go through my files, and that aint ever happening.

Besides, you guys do realize that a person using a hacked client can just use two different instances of Minecraft. One that is legit in every way, stored in the default installation directory, and another 'hacked' installation somewhere hidden away in the file system. So even if they did do this, they would have to know the exact installation directory of the hacked client to be able to find anything.

 

[65jes89]

Alright, alright, IF it is decided by them not me that they should do something like this, my suggestion is not to install screensharing because something similar already exists in regular minecraft.

1. The player reports the hacker to the staff members.
2. The staff member goes into spectator mode and /tps to the suspected player.
3. While in spectator mode they punch the accused player so they can watch from the player's level of view.

Pros to this:

1. They do not have to download anything else serverside as this can be done in vanilla minecraft.
2. It is less invasive as it does not let them see the player's GUI (Their hotbar or if they've pushed F3 etc.)
3. The hacker would not know they are there letting the moderator watch what they are doing without disturbances. (Unless they log off)

But the cons..

1. Because you can't see their GUI you won't know right away if they are hacking.
2. You may not be able to see the same direction the player is looking.(You might always be looking North? I'm not entirely sure.)

Click to shrink...

This would do legitimately nothing.

Hm when I first read this I thought it was something like mods being able to see your screen IN GAME and I thought ok no big deal. But you're saying I'd have to download some software, install it, and then let them root around in my files?

Yeah that's gonna be a big hell no from me. Not that I don't trust the mods but... that's way too invasive.

Really the best and least invasive way to prevent hacked clients/ banned mods is for Massivecraft to have its own custom launcher/mod pack that checks what mods you have installed.

Click to shrink...

Again, just seeing your screen in game will do next to nothing. The software used is generally join.me. It's more or less the same as screen sharing in skype; they don't have any actual control of what you're doing on your computer, they can just see what's going on. If you decide it's too invasive and worth getting banned for, just log off and take the ban. But frankly I can't imagine what files you have on your computer that are that embarrassing. Any program you make that just checks for mods installed is going to be easy to get around would have to be more like the anticheats valve and league use, which are significantly more invasive since they can see what you're doing at any given time without your knowledge.

 

[CptSilvyrall]

This would do legitimately nothing.

Click to shrink...

From what I understood until I read

Spoiler: This

https://mods.curse.com/bukkit-plugins/minecraft/screenshare

Screensharing was where the moderator could only see the player's screen to determine if they were hacking...
@B0W I saw that you edited the main post after I had already commented? What did that affect? Unless it was edited by a moderator too, it just says "Last Edited" not "Last Edited by a Moderator"

 

[__Kitsune__]

The best thing abt all of this, is that the only people opposed to it don't PVP or know that they'll get caught cheating and so they don't want something that actually fuccin works. Also @CptSilvyrall im going to guess you don't pvp, if you don't then don't try to distract from the threads purpose.

 

[65jes89]

From what I understood until I read

Spoiler: This

https://mods.curse.com/bukkit-plugins/minecraft/screenshare

Screensharing was where the moderator could only see the player's screen to determine if they were hacking...
@B0W I saw that you edited the main post after I had already commented? What did that affect? Unless it was edited by a moderator too, it just says "Last Edited" not "Last Edited by a Moderator"

Click to shrink...

All that plugin does is send a link to the user... It does nothing to check for hacked clients or otherwise. What we're suggesting gives no control to moderators beyond seeing someone's screen, including their desktop. This means it includes checking through relevant files. However, the player is 100% in control at any time; they can stop the screen share at any time, they can refuse to follow the moderator's instructions, etc. If you've ever used Skype's screen share feature, it's that, but uses another service because skype is a pain to use in cases like these, and most people don't like freely giving away their Skype contact details.

 

[Proudbucket]

The point is not whether screen-sharing works or not.
It is intrusive and for that reason alone it should not be implemented.

If staff would ask me to install a screen-sharing program I would refuse even if that would mean a ban.
And no, the "if you don't do anything wrong you have nothing to hide" is not a good argument.
I'm a responsible player that values its privacy.

 

[Typhenon]

The point is not whether screen-sharing works or not.
It is intrusive and for that reason alone it should not be implemented.

If staff would ask me to install a screen-sharing program I would refuse even if that would mean a ban.
And no, the "if you don't do anything wrong you have nothing to hide" is not a good argument.
I'm a responsible player that values its privacy.

Click to shrink...

It's not intrusive though! Unless you have dick pics as your background of your pc the staff won't be able to see anything, they don't control what your computer is doing, all they do is see your screen, they tell you over voice chat which folders to go into etc. If you don't want them to see those folders you can just tell them no, you are in complete control when it's happening, the staff have no control other than being able to ask you which folders to go into. and besides you don't pvp so this wouldn't affect you, this doesn't affect the majority of the people against this because you don't pvp! You're not gunna get screenshared for hacking in roleplay cuz that's not possible

Hm when I first read this I thought it was something like mods being able to see your screen IN GAME and I thought ok no big deal. But you're saying I'd have to download some software, install it, and then let them root around in my files?

Yeah that's gonna be a big hell no from me. Not that I don't trust the mods but... that's way too invasive.

Really the best and least invasive way to prevent hacked clients/ banned mods is for Massivecraft to have its own custom launcher/mod pack that checks what mods you have installed.

Click to shrink...

Same thing I said to proudbucket + massive having a custom launcher is really pointless, first of all it'd be super easy to get by and second of all do you realize how much work tech staff could put into making a custom launcher? Alot. Screensharing is easier, faster and not actually invasive. Plus you would never get screenshared because you don't pvp so this doesn't affect you

 

[Typhenon]

For anyone still confused by screensharing heres a video of it
Go to 9:15 in the video to see the screenshare

If you don't realize what's happening here, the guy making the video isn't doing anything he's the staff and he's just telling the player which folders to go into, he has no control over the player's computer