Pvp Change Brainstorming

Winterless

Winterless

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Aight here's the skinny

With world deletion happening soon, staff are moving to focus on some other areas of the server, specifically related to Factions and PvP

After some.... harsh but fair criticism from @Morbytogan on his farewell post, related to areas such as grinding, I'd like to make this post for players to voice their opinions directly to a staff member, yours truly.

Which is where you come in. What would you like to see for pvp changes and factions as a whole? I know that McMMO repair is a big topic making the rounds, and I'd like some player opinions as to specifics such as diamond cost etc. Currently, I like the idea of making the diamond cost extremely high, but with 100 percent enchantment retention, allowing rich players with a lot of diamonds to utilise them, thus acting as a diamond sink. I do not believe personally that removing armour from the economy i a particularly good idea, as it creates more grind for little reason. Besides, not everyone has 1k repair either.

This is not promising anything concrete, I just want to ask the community their thoughts. We as a staff team hear often that we don't listen enough, and we're all trying to fix it.

So, what would you like to see, PvP, Factions, or otherwise?

(Putting in general so that it gets more attention)

Tagging people with thoughts
@Morbytogan @Edrom @Sevak @Shaneski101 @Herecy @hardname12 @MazzerDK @Zacatero @65jes89 @jquaile
 
From what I heard the reason they removed arcane repair was to decrease supply, and make the price go up. But it seems the prices have barely changed since the demand has gone down as well, since nobody wants to pay so much for an item that breaks within 30 minutes. Perhaps this fix didn't improve the situation, and a different one should be considered.
The increased diamond cost seems to fix two issues at once, and it might be worthwhile to look into it.
 
JepTheLegend said:
From what I heard the reason they removed arcane repair was to decrease supply, and make the price go up. But it seems the prices have barely changed since the demand has gone down as well, since nobody wants to pay so much for an item that breaks within 30 minutes. Perhaps this fix didn't improve the situation, and a different one should be considered.
The increased diamond cost seems to fix two issues at once, and it might be worthwhile to look into it.
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Exactly. And now, people are actually quitting the server because of the excessive grind involved in repairing armour. The way I see it, I think it's more important to focus on gameplay and player enjoyment, rather than economy. If we were talking about increasing weapon price I'd see no problem with that, but with armour it makes little sense since it simply impedes gameplay and makes it harder to get into PvP.
 
Regardless of the shitty events occurring before this, we do find ourselves in the unique situation where I'm without a PVP consultant. I've not made any PVP or survival related decisions in the past 2 years, just "doing" and changing config files on command by Game lead. Now that Game lead is sort of broken up, it'd be interesting to see if Winterless can lead a bunch of people to form a think tank that would provide me with the changes that need to be made in configs, instead of me just droning after the opinions of a single person.
 
Armour

I agree fully with @JepTheLegend, however there could also be other possibilities out there.
One potential possibility is to cap enchantments at say sharp2 prot2 or something, like on HCF. This reduces the amount of grind players need to do to make a new set significantly and wouldn't damage the economy. With the question of "but what happens to the items already out there?", I'm aware that MassiveCraft has some sort of enchantment modifier plugin, as they were able to remove Thorns without issues. They could simply make the current prot4 equal to prot2 and make prot4 unenchantable thereon.

Potions

It's good that most MCMMO potions are now gone, however there are still more that should go, healthboost and resistance mainly. Healthboost & resistance potions add nothing to the server but more confusion in PvP, as you have even more potions to manage and drinking them is difficult when TPS drops. I feel like the reason healthboost + resistance are still here is because it adds some sort of extra protection against all the lag that happens when PvP occurs, so that players don't die as frequently to BS lag issues, and also because it matches the damage done thanks to MCMMO weapons, which leads me on to two things.

Damage

Reduce the damage a bit and make it more consistent. You have no clue when you're being hit whether you're going to take half a heart or 4 hearts of damage on Massive. This *needs* to be fixed.

Lag in Worlds

I think that the world deletion may help with this, but TPS drops to like 5 whenever there's a battle of upwards of about 6 people. This is obviously not a good thing as it makes big fights impossible, impractical, and a waste of time. These serious lag issues need to be fixed, and my theory is that plugins are helping to cause this.

I myself have hosted several servers where big fights could occur with almost no lag, and this was just off my crappy 2010 laptop. The issue is (I think) is that Massive plugins send too many checks when players attack - check to see who they're hitting, what faction they're in, the healthbars need to constantly be updated 20 times per second, then mcmmo damage modifiers need to be done, as well as potions constantly being thrown (as there are so many random pots we need during pvp), if any spells are being cast, etc. There is so much going on and if all this could be reduced then the game would be much more playable. I myself do not think that the massivecraft health below player names are necessary - for three reasons.
1) they cause lag as it's done with a messy plugin
2) you don't need to know exact percentages as there are only 20 health points on a player anyway, not 100. These percentages also cause unneccessary confusion and lag
3) it can be done without lag, much more easily with just vanilla MC. "/scoreboard objectives add playerHealth health " (Would show 20 below their username, displaying their health)

Also, MassiveRestore helps to cause lag. I know it's already less laggy than it used to be, but still. There is a chunk updates happening almost all the time cause a lot of lag. Maybe slow down MassiveRestore even more?




These are just some of the first steps that I believe Massive should take to improve the gameplay for PvP. I have many more ideas that I'll share in the future.
 
Morbytogan said:
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The Game Department is constantly looking for ideas and I know players get frustrated when they get shut down but we try and get every single idea a go and we review them. We will take these on board and see what we can do. Currently we are working on multiple other changes too that we have in mind.
 
@CnocBride and I are making a "PvP Think-tank" where we can discuss our ideas for the server in a Discord group. If you want to be a part of it, contact me through pm, ingame, or on this thread.
 
SoulSunder said:
Maybe not Nerf everything in McMMO to oblivion, try adjusting it for example, try to create a rock paper scissors effect with unarmed, swords, axes. Maybe give axes immunity to unarmed, make give swords countering back to axes, make unarmed able to disarm swords users ect. I'm sure this would be hard to balance and constant changes would be needed, but the current PvP meta is so stale and ResidentSleeper, I'd rather go to another server and PvP instead or just play another game entirely. Giving an interesting mechanic to PvP would make it fun again for a lot of people I have spoken to. Right now it's literally a circle jerk about who can click and get the most bs ping possible.
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I'd really rather not auto lose to someone because they're using a different weapon than me
 
Bows do practically no damage anymore. They're virtually unusable. Fix.

This could be something to do with some god armour sets having Projectile Protection IV alongside Protection IV(These sets were from the Armour4All I believe), if this is truly the case(I have yet to test this theory) maybe just disable Projectile Protection like we did with Thorns.
 
AgentLew said:
Bows do practically no damage anymore. They're virtually unusable. Fix.

This could be something to do with some god armour sets having Projectile Protection IV alongside Protection IV(These sets were from the Armour4All I believe), if this is truly the case(I have yet to test this theory) maybe just disable Projectile Protection like we did with Thorns.
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I think that's to do with MCMMO, not Projectile Prot.
 
Something @Sevak and I and the members of our faction have discussed isn't with really any mechanics, but the overall attitude towards pvp which is driving certain people into boredom. Like @Sevak and @Sarinex for example.

Our issue is we notice one person flames, tells the other side to come raid, other side raids, either wins or loses, and its over with. It feels like an obligation or a chore now sometimes to go raid, and there's not many surprise raids that end up happening unless you formally announce yourself "lol we at @" or "knock knock @" And other fights are "meet me here and we'll fight" and honestly personally that is also starting to become boring to me.

A solution to this one doesn't come from any technical code or improvement to the server, its on us to make it fun again to be honest. Gone are the times when a bunch of people just show up to a faction and fight, for a long period of time. Back then factions had more meaning and respect compared to now. Nowadays the biggest raids only last 20-30 minutes because once one side majorly wins, no one wants to keep going on the losing side.

That and solo raiding is almost entirely impossible anymore. Watch any old raid video and you'll see something common. Solo raiding, SoTotallyAce raiding Algaron and 1v5ing, or 1v3ing Kkkillp assembly and someone else, maybe morby i think? Sevak 1v3ing Herecy and co. Skywardsword 1v3ing, Skysoh solo raiding. It's impossible to fight more than 1 person right now because you'll run out of pots within minutes. Skullsplit and serrated aren't saving people in these situations either. I would love to see a tanky race/trait system come back to bring back some beefiness into pvp, the current meta seems too harsh for a lot of people where it punishes good players once they are outnumbered. Not everyone can afford to even the playing field, not everyone is active at the same time.
 
Shaneski101 said:
Something @Sevak and I and the members of our faction have discussed isn't with really any mechanics, but the overall attitude towards pvp which is driving certain people into boredom. Like @Sevak and @Sarinex for example.

Our issue is we notice one person flames, tells the other side to come raid, other side raids, either wins or loses, and its over with. It feels like an obligation or a chore now sometimes to go raid, and there's not many surprise raids that end up happening unless you formally announce yourself "lol we at @" or "knock knock @" And other fights are "meet me here and we'll fight" and honestly personally that is also starting to become boring to me.

A solution to this one doesn't come from any technical code or improvement to the server, its on us to make it fun again to be honest. Gone are the times when a bunch of people just show up to a faction and fight, for a long period of time. Back then factions had more meaning and respect compared to now. Nowadays the biggest raids only last 20-30 minutes because once one side majorly wins, no one wants to keep going on the losing side.

That and solo raiding is almost entirely impossible anymore. Watch any old raid video and you'll see something common. Solo raiding, SoTotallyAce raiding Algaron and 1v5ing, or 1v3ing Kkkillp assembly and someone else, maybe morby i think? Sevak 1v3ing Herecy and co. Skywardsword 1v3ing, Skysoh solo raiding. It's impossible to fight more than 1 person right now because you'll run out of pots within minutes. Skullsplit and serrated aren't saving people in these situations either. I would love to see a tanky race/trait system come back to bring back some beefiness into pvp, the current meta seems too harsh for a lot of people where it punishes good players once they are outnumbered. Not everyone can afford to even the playing field, not everyone is active at the same time.
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Exactly, but for this to happen it neeeds to be less of a grind to get sets. I miss the days of rocking up to Tyberia by myself and killing everyone in a 6v1 despite being trapped in a small house
 
Shaneski101 said:
I would love to see a tanky race/trait system come back to bring back some beefiness into pvp,
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The issue of run into there is that you then have team fights that drag on forever, without kills. The reason those people were able to 1v3 and whatever wasn't because of tankiness, it was because in 2013 none of us knew how to PvP except for a few people like ace. I mean, if you watch ace's videos he's literally using drinkables in half of them. The skill gap was just large enough to allow them to do that; today there's a lot more people who have a vague understanding of what they're doing, and so you're going to have a more difficult time 3v1ing. I mean, this was the era where skullsplit let you 3 shot people lol. There's just no way we'll be able to let you win an outnumbered fight, regardless how tanks you are, because they'll be just as tanky. It'll let you survive doing that type of thing, sure, but at the cost of making team fights take forever and reducing the overall number of deaths, which is less fun, imo. I wouldn't mind a very slight nerf to damage, but one optimized to make it a little easier to handle occasional damage spikes from crits and whatnot, not to allow 3v1ing.

Also traits are disgusting and miserable and even if the damage was reduced should never be added back
 
Shaneski101 said:
Something @Sevak and I and the members of our faction have discussed isn't with really any mechanics, but the overall attitude towards pvp which is driving certain people into boredom. Like @Sevak and @Sarinex for example.

Our issue is we notice one person flames, tells the other side to come raid, other side raids, either wins or loses, and its over with. It feels like an obligation or a chore now sometimes to go raid, and there's not many surprise raids that end up happening unless you formally announce yourself "lol we at @" or "knock knock @" And other fights are "meet me here and we'll fight" and honestly personally that is also starting to become boring to me.

A solution to this one doesn't come from any technical code or improvement to the server, its on us to make it fun again to be honest. Gone are the times when a bunch of people just show up to a faction and fight, for a long period of time. Back then factions had more meaning and respect compared to now. Nowadays the biggest raids only last 20-30 minutes because once one side majorly wins, no one wants to keep going on the losing side.

That and solo raiding is almost entirely impossible anymore. Watch any old raid video and you'll see something common. Solo raiding, SoTotallyAce raiding Algaron and 1v5ing, or 1v3ing Kkkillp assembly and someone else, maybe morby i think? Sevak 1v3ing Herecy and co. Skywardsword 1v3ing, Skysoh solo raiding. It's impossible to fight more than 1 person right now because you'll run out of pots within minutes. Skullsplit and serrated aren't saving people in these situations either. I would love to see a tanky race/trait system come back to bring back some beefiness into pvp, the current meta seems too harsh for a lot of people where it punishes good players once they are outnumbered. Not everyone can afford to even the playing field, not everyone is active at the same time.
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100% agree on the last two points especially. Solo raiding is no longer viable and, considering I have janky timezones and a faction with people in university, I'm often left by myself. I wish traits would come back, and that definitely is something that can be considered down the line, but idk how much Tech work that would entail.
 
65jes89 said:
The issue of run into there is that you then have team fights that drag on forever, without kills. The reason those people were able to 1v3 and whatever wasn't because of tankiness, it was because in 2013 none of us knew how to PvP except for a few people like ace. I mean, if you watch ace's videos he's literally using drinkables in half of them. The skill gap was just large enough to allow them to do that; today there's a lot more people who have a vague understanding of what they're doing, and so you're going to have a more difficult time 3v1ing. I mean, this was the era where skullsplit let you 3 shot people lol. There's just no way we'll be able to let you win an outnumbered fight, regardless how tanks you are, because they'll be just as tanky. It'll let you survive doing that type of thing, sure, but at the cost of making team fights take forever and reducing the overall number of deaths, which is less fun, imo. I wouldn't mind a very slight nerf to damage, but one optimized to make it a little easier to handle occasional damage spikes from crits and whatnot, not to allow 3v1ing.

Also traits are disgusting and miserable and even if the damage was reduced should never be added back
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It would however be possible to increase the damage of skullsplit, making one person more of a threat. That way you don't have to get the whole squad on to fight.

I'll try to write up something for this soon
 
Inflammatory comments will not be tolerated on this thread or in any future PvP think tanks that are established by the Game department. Without respectful discussion, we cannot get anywhere.
 
  1. MCMMO - In 2016, when Massive had to make adjustments to become EULA compliant, a feature of premium that I think has been severely overlooked in importance, was removed. Premiums used to gain double MCMMO XP. Combine this with whatever issues there are with MassiveMobs and the damage that you do to them, and it creates a huge issue of no one wants to level their stats. Premium players back then went from gaining extra xp, to gaining less than normal now. We want players to grind, whether it's to level their stats, or just to get the xp to level their armor. It gives them a sense of purpose, and if it takes 15 minutes to go up one level in axes, they lose motivation. If we increase the MCMMO XP gains, we can easily justify using vanilla repairs.
    1. Repair - I like the idea @Maytee brought up in the survival meeting, where repairing with an iron block is brought back, but made more expensive and given a risk factor of potentially weakening your armor
    2. Alchemy - Health boost and resistance need to be removed.
    3. Skullsplit/Serrated Strikes - Once damage is mitigated to balance out the removal of Health Boost and Resistance, finding an appropriate balance to skull splitter and serrated strikes should be considered. A lot of times, people won't fight due to being outnumbered. Solo raiding is improbable. These abilities make that possible.
  2. Crisis of Kings - There is no reason to compete. My faction is currently a part of Crisis of Kings but I've so far put zero effort into it because I simply don't care about winning a lore item. Bragging rights would be enough for me, if the opposing PvP factions were actually trying, but they aren't either. So let's boost the rewards. Some ideas I have listed below. I'd love to hear more @Viscar @Wooperr @Winterless
    1. Permanent Increase in Member Cap by 5 - With the member cap sitting at 50 now, I think a reason to compete in this monthly tournament would be to have that increased. Crisis of Kings isn't about personal gain, it's not about one person winning a trophy, it's about being the best faction. Shouldn't the winner then have the best faction? This also creates a market on faction sales. Factions with higher member caps down the line raise in value. And no faction is going to be winning Crisis of Kings so often that their member cap gets too high, but maybe we could put a cap on factions at 70 members or something.
    2. Double XP (MCMMO or Vanilla) for a month
more to come
 
Sevak said:
  1. MCMMO - In 2016, when Massive had to make adjustments to become EULA compliant, a feature of premium that I think has been severely overlooked in importance, was removed. Premiums used to gain double MCMMO XP. Combine this with whatever issues there are with MassiveMobs and the damage that you do to them, and it creates a huge issue of no one wants to level their stats. Premium players back then went from gaining extra xp, to gaining less than normal now. We want players to grind, whether it's to level their stats, or just to get the xp to level their armor. It gives them a sense of purpose, and if it takes 15 minutes to go up one level in axes, they lose motivation. If we increase the MCMMO XP gains, we can easily justify using vanilla repairs.
    1. Repair - I like the idea @Maytee brought up in the survival meeting, where repairing with an iron block is brought back, but made more expensive and given a risk factor of potentially weakening your armor
    2. Alchemy - Health boost and resistance need to be removed.
    3. Skullsplit/Serrated Strikes - Once damage is mitigated to balance out the removal of Health Boost and Resistance, finding an appropriate balance to skull splitter and serrated strikes should be considered. A lot of times, people won't fight due to being outnumbered. Solo raiding is improbable. These abilities make that possible.
  2. Crisis of Kings - There is no reason to compete. My faction is currently a part of Crisis of Kings but I've so far put zero effort into it because I simply don't care about winning a lore item. Bragging rights would be enough for me, if the opposing PvP factions were actually trying, but they aren't either. So let's boost the rewards. Some ideas I have listed below. I'd love to hear more @Viscar @Wooperr @Winterless
    1. Permanent Increase in Member Cap by 5 - With the member cap sitting at 50 now, I think a reason to compete in this monthly tournament would be to have that increased. Crisis of Kings isn't about personal gain, it's not about one person winning a trophy, it's about being the best faction. Shouldn't the winner then have the best faction? This also creates a market on faction sales. Factions with higher member caps down the line raise in value. And no faction is going to be winning Crisis of Kings so often that their member cap gets too high, but maybe we could put a cap on factions at 70 members or something.
    2. Double XP (MCMMO or Vanilla) for a month
more to come
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Mostly agree with this, except on MCMMO Repair. Out of the people I've talked to on the server, just about everyone (bar a few exceptions) wants there to be 100% arcane repair re-added, with a higher diamond cost. I think if the possibility exists that the armour will be weakened, then people just won't do it. I sure as hell know I won't, and it puts us right back to square one in terms of PvP participation.

Also, on the incentive to Crisis of Kings, I don't know about other factions but at least in Belegost we try and win because we care about our faction's lore and the characters' stories within them. That's enough for me. We're never going to have enough people to be competitive on a large scale in PvP, partly because every pvper on the server is in two factions now, but faction lore is enough of a reason for us.
 
Sevak said:
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I do agree better rewards are something that will improve the competition overall. We want to ensure that rewards are good enough to incentivize competition within Crisis of Kings but are not overly OP. There have been a few ideas and suggestions that we are currently open towards and we want even more suggestions.
  • Currently we are planning on introducing a new free chunks rule. Due to the recent member cap, if you have 50 members at full power you can claim 1500 chunks. That's plenty but some factions want more than that because they want to build massive, sprawling bases. While 10 chunks isn't huge, we hope it will encourage people to get involved more. Your suggestion about a member cap increase of 5 is something I also like, but my one concern is that I don't even know if it is possible. I will have a look into it but it's definitely something we could consider, however, as you said there must be hard cap because we can't allow factions to swell in size simply because they are winning CoK. A hard cap of about 70 sounds good because when the faction caps were being discussed internally, it was suggested an optimal cap would be anywhere between 50 and 70.
  • The McMMO boosts have also been suggested. I will see if this is possible, most likely is as we can just hand out an XP boost but restrict it to the faction members. However, that would mean any new players who join mightn't be able to get the XP boost.
  • Potion materials such as ghast tears and glistering melons are currently being looked into. We don't want to give out too little or too much at the same time.
  • Writing this post has brought something to the forefront of my mind. Back in the CoK meetings there was a suggestion to introduce a new icon in-game for the winners of CoK. This icon, most likely a crown, would be given to the leader of the faction that has won the Crown of Hadar in the previous month. It really is just a recognition reward and is just supposed to give of an air of prestige. You're name could also be recoloured just to make it stand out.
Now, on to less CoK suggestions and comments:
  • I do agree about the McMMO issues. It is far too hard in my opinion to grind my swords anymore. I currently stand at 725, it's extremely hard for me to move any further than that. I remember when I was a new player and it much more fun to grind. I don't think I have seriously grinded for days on end since 2015/2016.
  • The /dynmap hide command was discussed by players at the last factions meeting and seems to be a very hot topic. There is plenty of debate from both sides of the aisle on this issue. A lot of PvPers seem to be in favour of it, while a lot of more laid back survivalists want to see it remain in place. My one concern is that there are certain players on this server that just like to kill new players for fun. Ok, that's all fine and well but when it gets to the point that new players are quitting because they feel they're being constantly attacked, that's not ok. People will say "Oh learn to fight back" or "Stay inside" but that's just an ignorant opinion and indicates you are only thinking about ones self. There were some suggestions about this:
    • Add a 1-2 week grace period for new players, where /dynmap hide is automatically enabled. Players are given regular notices that their dynmap hide will expire after them 2 weeks. This will get players prepared for what is to come. I do like this idea as it allows people to settle in.
    • Some people said could /dynmap hide be automatically enabled when in faction land but not in the Wilderness. So once you leave the borders of your faction, you are at risk of being attacked. The advantage about this is, when another player wants to kill you, you can see them coming and have some time preparing for this
  • McMMO power level. Originally this was removed a while back and I have been considering asking for it to be reintroduced. I know some players want it because it adds prestige. Similar to the suggestion about a Crisis of Kings tag or something like that. Players like yourself, who have high power levels may like this and want it to be implemented so please give me your opinion on it.
I am very much pleased with the ideas being generated from this thread and I can assure you that they are all being taken on board. There will be more discussion after the PvP tournament on a PvP Think Tank which the basis for has already been set up. I recommend if you want to take part, please express your interest to either myself, Winterless, Maytee or jquaile.
 
CnocBride said:
McMMO power level. Originally this was removed a while back and I have been considering asking for it to be reintroduced. I know some players want it because it adds prestige. Similar to the suggestion about a Crisis of Kings tag or something like that. Players like yourself, who have high power levels may like this and want it to be implemented so please give me your opinion on it.
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give
 
Winterless said:
Mostly agree with this, except on MCMMO Repair. Out of the people I've talked to on the server, just about everyone (bar a few exceptions) wants there to be 100% arcane repair re-added, with a higher diamond cost. I think if the possibility exists that the armour will be weakened, then people just won't do it. I sure as hell know I won't, and it puts us right back to square one in terms of PvP participation.

Also, on the incentive to Crisis of Kings, I don't know about other factions but at least in Belegost we try and win because we care about our faction's lore and the characters' stories within them. That's enough for me. We're never going to have enough people to be competitive on a large scale in PvP, partly because every pvper on the server is in two factions now, but faction lore is enough of a reason for us.
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It's not enough for the other PvP factions though unfortunately.
CnocBride said:
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My worry with the extra 10 chunks is that it just isn't enough. I feel like we've been dancing around prizes trying to find something that isn't really an actual prize, worrying about the economy or one faction becoming too powerful, but that's the point of Crisis of Kings. To be the best faction. Increased member cap, double xp, make it the faction people want to be in. 10 extra chunks really won't do much when players have alt factions anyways. I do like the crown icon idea. And do you mean power level under the name plate? If you can have this while keeping health percentages that'd be alright. Or having it switch to health percentage when combat is activated.
 
Sevak said:
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Increased member cap, I like it but I don't know if it's possible to edit the config to allow only ONE faction to just have +5 members. XP boosts can most likely be introduced as well. Thank you for all the suggestions by the way, they have been fantastically constructive :)
 
Winterless said:
Mostly agree with this, except on MCMMO Repair. Out of the people I've talked to on the server, just about everyone (bar a few exceptions) wants there to be 100% arcane repair re-added, with a higher diamond cost. I think if the possibility exists that the armour will be weakened, then people just won't do it. I sure as hell know I won't, and it puts us right back to square one in terms of PvP participation.
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100% arcane forging is going to have the same problem as before, regardless of how much the diamond cost is raised, because diamonds are almost worthless; it's just going to hurt the god armor price more. If people don't want to use it because there's a slight chance of their armor degrading by 1 or 2 enchant levels, well frankly, that's their problem lol. It's not like vanilla repair is being removed, they're still welcome to use that, but I think anyone would quickly find that the occasional armor downgrade is preferable to spending 30 minutes repairing a set.
 
65jes89 said:
100% arcane forging is going to have the same problem as before, regardless of how much the diamond cost is raised, because diamonds are almost worthless; it's just going to hurt the god armor price more. If people don't want to use it because there's a slight chance of their armor degrading by 1 or 2 enchant levels, well frankly, that's their problem lol. It's not like vanilla repair is being removed, they're still welcome to use that, but I think anyone would quickly find that the occasional armor downgrade is preferable to spending 30 minutes repairing a set.
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We want to have a quick, but risky and costly option, and a slow, while safe and cheap option
 
Sevak said:
Double XP (MCMMO or Vanilla) for a month
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I'd rather this become a donation store perk similar to double drops and the like.

I may not be an active member of the survival side, but the thought of one faction having game buffs that nobody else has seems odd to me. Though maybe that's something you guys are fine with, in that case have at it.
 
FireFan96 said:
I'd rather this become a donation store perk similar to double drops and the like.

I may not be an active member of the survival side, but the thought of one faction having game buffs that nobody else has seems odd to me. Though maybe that's something you guys are fine with, in that case have at it.
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If it were a donation store perk, it would need to be given to everybody unless it would violate the EULA. Personally, these items need to be strictly confined to Crisis of Kings to give the competition some uniqueness and an actual reason to strive for it. If it were a donation perk, players would be just like "Why get it, when someone can pay X$ to give it to everyone on the server". While it would probably be a good influx of income for the server, I personally value the enjoyment of players in factions over the money we can generate from donations.
 
65jes89 said:
100% arcane forging is going to have the same problem as before, regardless of how much the diamond cost is raised, because diamonds are almost worthless; it's just going to hurt the god armor price more. If people don't want to use it because there's a slight chance of their armor degrading by 1 or 2 enchant levels, well frankly, that's their problem lol. It's not like vanilla repair is being removed, they're still welcome to use that, but I think anyone would quickly find that the occasional armor downgrade is preferable to spending 30 minutes repairing a set.
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Again, I disagree that we should even be attempting to increase the cost of God Armour. The people who benefit from PvPing being accessible FAR outweighs the people who benefit from God Armour increasing in price.
  • You don't get God armour from kills
  • Massive doesn't have the ridiculous methods of getting XP like other servers, so grinding out a set of armour can take an hour
  • You don't have anyone leaving the server because of God Armour being "too cheap" (which is a matter of perspective anyway), you do have people leaving because of Armour being impossible to repair, however.
Personally, the only people I see benefiting from a price hike in God Armour are people who sell it and have extreme amounts of it, people I don't think we should particularly be making changes on the server for, considering in my opinion that PvPers are integral to the Factions community.
 
This response is 100% about repair on MassiveCraft.

I think it would be nice to have repairing on MassiveCraft be a two-tier system.

The first tier is using the vanilla anvil to repair your armor. Grind the XP in the darkroom, and then use the vanilla anvil to repair until it just becomes too expense XP wise to contain using the vanilla anvil feasibly.

I think we all agree that there's nothing we need to change there, except for how much XP drops and how hard mobs are to grind, but that's another discussion.

The second tier is MCMMO anvil repair, and we have two ways to go about this. 100% arcane forging or not. If we go with an arcane forging that isn't maxed at 100% keep chance, then the diamond cost might only need to be scaled up a bit from what the diamond cost would be using the vanilla anvil. If we go with a 100% keep chance, then I think the diamond cost should be raised exponentially to repair a piece of armor from almost broken to full.

Ideally I'd like to see people use the vanilla anvil first, and then switch to the MCMMO anvil once their armor becomes too expensive to repair via vanilla, but I imagine people with a fairly large supply of diamonds are just going to go straight to using the MCMMO repair b/c they'd rather use a few extra diamonds than grind the XP needed for the vanilla anvil. I guess in the end it's going to up to how much they value diamonds versus the time they spend grinding XP.

As to what would happen to the cost of god armor/diamonds, it's all going to naturally adjust itself. If PVP is popping off and everyone is running through armor, then it makes sense the demand will increase and so will the price. We'd just have to wait and see.
 
Alj23 said:
This response is 100% about repair on MassiveCraft.

I think it would be nice to have repairing on MassiveCraft be a two-tier system.

The first tier is using the vanilla anvil to repair your armor. Grind the XP in the darkroom, and then use the vanilla anvil to repair until it just becomes too expense XP wise to contain using the vanilla anvil feasibly.

I think we all agree that there's nothing we need to change there, except for how much XP drops and how hard mobs are to grind, but that's another discussion.

The second tier is MCMMO anvil repair, and we have two ways to go about this. 100% arcane forging or not. If we go with an arcane forging that isn't maxed at 100% keep chance, then the diamond cost might only need to be scaled up a bit from what the diamond cost would be using the vanilla anvil. If we go with a 100% keep chance, then I think the diamond cost should be raised exponentially to repair a piece of armor from almost broken to full.

Ideally I'd like to see people use the vanilla anvil first, and then switch to the MCMMO anvil once their armor becomes too expensive to repair via vanilla, but I imagine people with a fairly large supply of diamonds are just going to go straight to using the MCMMO repair b/c they'd rather use a few extra diamonds than grind the XP needed for the vanilla anvil. I guess in the end it's going to up to how much they value diamonds versus the time they spend grinding XP.

As to what would happen to the cost of god armor/diamonds, it's all going to naturally adjust itself. If PVP is popping off and everyone is running through armor, then it makes sense the demand will increase and so will the price. We'd just have to wait and see.
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If we are going with 100% keep chance, diamonds need to be a huge part of the process.
 
CnocBride said:
If we are going with 100% keep chance, diamonds need to be a huge part of the process.
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Agreed

Though, I think if armour costed like 8 diamonds to repair from broken, it would put a significant dent in diamond cost

Let's think about it

8 diamonds per piece every ~3 fights
32 diamonds every 3 fights
6 fights for a stack of diamonds

Given that there are EASILY 6 fights in a day, you'd be burning through diamonds like a madman

I used to have like 5 stacks of diamond blocks

Now I've got 1 and a half, and that's from vanilla repair alone.
 
CnocBride said:
If we are going with 100% keep chance, diamonds need to be a huge part of the process.
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It takes 24 diamonds to make a full set of armor. If we established that you should at least put as many diamonds into repairing as you did originally crafting it, that would be 6 diamonds per piece of armor. Or we could double it and make it 12 diamonds needed per piece of armor.

That's if like you said, we want diamonds to be an especially huge part of the repair process.
 
  • I'd like the idea of everyone having an extra 4 hearts added to everyones health.
  • double xp weekends.
  • some post about teaching cannons so that new players can experiment in defending since they don't have stats yet.
  • we need to know more about massive magic and balancing it
I'll think of other stuff later I gotta go.
 
Winterless said:
Because nerfing damage affects a wider spectrum of things related to things other than PvP, such as mobs and PvE events. Adding 4 extra hearts is a lot easier than reconfiguring the entirety of MassiveMobs to the new damage system.
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Massive mobs needs a re-evaluation of damage anyways, IMO. Giving more hearts would just be confusing for new players and seems rather cheap to me.
 

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