My Actual Thoughts Of Massive These Days

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_Vidaar said:
I will start by saying I've never played an HCF server before, so I'm not INCREDIBLY informed. But I must say that based off of what I've seen, Massive isn't and will never be, an HCF server. And I adamantly believe that bringing in new and fresh ideas should never be looked down upon.

I know you've got good intentions in mind Sub, but your points and arguments don't seem to have much behind them. Change is good, that's just the way it is.
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Having played one owned by a Cow (not an insult as much as it sounds like one) I can say Massive is 100% not like a HCF server at all. We don't have enough microtransactions or any $400 ranks. Memes aside we are VERY far from that environment. Raiding on here is basically "lets go kill a few dudes until they get bored and sit in their base grinding instead of running into our swords" rather than the Arma3 hardcore serious ops like HCF servers. "We gonna flank in around the side, we have to do this at 5 am so everyone is asleep. They have a guy afk with a second monitor up in a room on their sand walls so if we break the outer sand wall it will trigger a lamp he can see so we have to move fast after the first 2000 distance tnt-wither hybrid canon shot hits. anyone without at least 4 stacks of Gapples is banned"

None of that was exaggeration either is the saddest part.
 
Conflee said:
Having played one owned by a Cow (not an insult as much as it sounds like one) I can say Massive is 100% not like a HCF server at all. We don't have enough microtransactions or any $400 ranks. Memes aside we are VERY far from that environment. Raiding on here is basically "lets go kill a few dudes until they get bored and sit in their base grinding instead of running into our swords" rather than the Arma3 hardcore serious ops like HCF servers. "We gonna flank in around the side, we have to do this at 5 am so everyone is asleep. They have a guy afk with a second monitor up in a room on their sand walls so if we break the outer sand wall it will trigger a lamp he can see so we have to move fast after the first 2000 distance tnt-wither hybrid canon shot hits. anyone without at least 4 stacks of Gapples is banned"

None of that was exaggeration either is the saddest part.
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hahaha sounds about right
 
@SubscriptShark I always stand by the idea that I need to be what I want to see.

What I can't do is stop the discussion, no matter how strange the ideas brought to the table are. What I already know though is that there are certain things about the server that can't change if it's in the interest of the staff to maintain a specific survival experience. Deaths 'Til Raidable would be one of those ideas off-limits, similar to how unthinkable it would be to allow griefing within faction territory or enable TNT in general. The talk will always happen, but the walk is something you shouldn't be too worried about any time soon.

My greatest goal as a player on this server is to bring people into survival. I have no specific emphasis for those people to be focused on, like roleplay or PvP, but I will always be aggressive at getting them to play in survival with my team and I. I designed Asteria to do this with overwhelming efficiency. As one of my advertisements says, I have five years of trial and error under my belt, and each passing day I get better at it. I know that I'm an effective recruiter, and I will always put the pedal to the metal. I'm not hungry for claim power though. I'm not here to "steal" people from other factions. I don't neglect my faction members until they leave the server. I don't know how many people noticed, but when Asteria did it's most recent migration to a new location after my hiatus, I assembled almost 30 veteran members who wanted to come back and play with me again. Not one advertisement required.

Earlier you were concerned about how my faction and others owned by veteran players come, go and come again with time. Remember that as the years go by, we're all getting older. Five years ago I was in high school. Now I'm in university. Time doesn't come as easy, and I always put my real life responsibilities over the game. When I go through major changes in my life in person, I often have to take long breaks during which I pop in to visit or disappear entirely. Other times the server will make a big change of policy that I have to take a while to adapt to. The most recent example of this was the faction member cap, which fundamentally changed the way I run Asteria. I still wait for the day it's removed, as I'd like to offer my members more new faces and things to do, but in the mean time I cope.

I take you want to improve the PvP environment on the server, so what are your options?
1. Add new PvPers. If you know you have some skill and the motivation to build a PvP-focused faction, then it's a great idea to get interested novices to join your faction for some good leadership and training to accustom them to the culture and strategies here. You don't have to be the only one either. There are plenty of veteran PvPers who support a cause like that.
2. Instigate PvP among the existing players. If I was in your shoes and could translate my other skills into PvP, I would try a public school sports league model. Every public school has a rival or two, but almost never are there truly good reasons to actually hate the other schools. That doesn't stop the spirit of the students who attend football games though. A similar approach is possible between factions. You have friends here that lead other factions, and some of them include PvP as part of their agenda. Find the ones that do. That's a great place to start, especially combined with 1.

I've been the leader of Asteria for my entire time on MassiveCraft, and I have a passion for this server more than any my team has played on before. Most of my team's history is here, and I want to keep it that way as long as I can. My favorite part about what I do is all the new people I get to meet and make friends with, all the while adding players to the survival experience. By making this post you show evidence of your passion for MassiveCraft too. Use it to rebuild the experience you love. I've rebuilt the Kingdom of Asteria I love eight separate times from the ground up. You can do this.
 
_Vidaar said:
I will start by saying I've never played an HCF server before, so I'm not INCREDIBLY informed. But I must say that based off of what I've seen, Massive isn't and will never be, an HCF server. And I adamantly believe that bringing in new and fresh ideas should never be looked down upon.

I know you've got good intentions in mind Sub, but your points and arguments don't seem to have much behind them. Change is good, that's just the way it is.
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Similarities between Massive and HCF:
  • Pot PvP
  • Tnt disabled
  • Literally nothing else
Conflee said:
Having played one owned by a Cow (not an insult as much as it sounds like one) I can say Massive is 100% not like a HCF server at all. We don't have enough microtransactions or any $400 ranks. Memes aside we are VERY far from that environment. Raiding on here is basically "lets go kill a few dudes until they get bored and sit in their base grinding instead of running into our swords" rather than the Arma3 hardcore serious ops like HCF servers. "We gonna flank in around the side, we have to do this at 5 am so everyone is asleep. They have a guy afk with a second monitor up in a room on their sand walls so if we break the outer sand wall it will trigger a lamp he can see so we have to move fast after the first 2000 distance tnt-wither hybrid canon shot hits. anyone without at least 4 stacks of Gapples is banned"

None of that was exaggeration either is the saddest part.
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The Archon is not HCF, btw. HCF is hardcore factions; factions like the archon with TNT and gapples and shit are just normal factions servers. HCF is Pot PvP, has classes, revolves around a DTR system, etc.
 
Alright my realistic take on this thread, enough joking:

Grains of salt:
- I have not played in about 2 years so things might have changed substantially from the last time I played
- I /do not/ PvP. (Unless forced to, and in which case, I am ass at it)

Points:
- I think that a dynamic environment for the server will ALWAYS be good, regardless of what any individual (including myself frequently) might say, specifically, because I think that at a very basic level, people just get bored if nothing changes forever.
- In addition, I think that change allows for constant improvement. There have been, are and always will be issues with PvP (and every other feature of this server and all other servers!) the best thing we as a community can do is try to steer the server towards fixing those issues and adding new things to the server that globally improve the experience. This can either be done directly, by becoming a staff member and influencing change (Which, as a notably ex-staff, I can vouch ACTUALLY DOES HAPPEN, Staff, regardless of rank were always given the opportunity to voice their opinions on changes the server needs, and the people who you needed to communicate with in order to implement a change were readily available, if a current or former staff member tells you otherwise, they are lying or were/are bad at working with others). Or, indirectly, by voicing your opinion here on the forums, contacting staff, etc. There are many ways to make sure that the people who need to hear your ideas actually hear them, even if you don't want to become a staff member. Again, staff aren't scary people and are usually just players like you who wanted to make a more dedicated impact on the server.
- There doesn't need to be any gameplay mechanics to make raiding less painful, we can solve that with rules and regulations (which, imo, is already a non-issue due to rules on extensive raiding and whatnot). Realistically, we could add things that might give new players an opportunity to get started on the server (A favorite of mine has always been the 1-month grace period for noobs so they can attempt to get off the ground, but, ofc, abuse, so, again, no idea.) but I think that the faster, easier and much, much simpler and more elegant solution is just making rules around this kind of thing to not make it unbearable.
- I am in support of Sub for making this thread, because, despite the fact that I 100% disagree with him and many other people here, THIS IS EXACTLY THE KIND OF THING PEOPLE NEED TO DO IF THEY ARE UNHAPPY!

tl;dr: staff listen to ideas, keep making forums posts, cry more.

thanks
 
Hot take:

Massivecraft isn't supposed to be a PVP server. It's supposed to be survival and roleplay and it's honestly doing pretty good at that.

I feel like it would be better if people would stop expecting this to be a PVP centered server, and focused on a flavor of PVP that would enhance the current survival situation instead of going against like it often does. Like for years have been saying how PVP is better on other servers... Well of course it will be lol those are PVP focus servers, this is not.

Sub has a good point when he says
SubscriptShark said:
Is this truly what the pvpers think is best for MASSIVE instead of their own personal gain?
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Because if you consider yourself just a PVP player, and you have an idea that the general survival players do not like, then that's already something that shouldn't happen because this is not a PVP server. Any PVP should align with the survival worlds, not vice versa.
 
Zacatero said:
Massivecraft isn't supposed to be a PVP server. It's supposed to be survival and roleplay and it's honestly doing pretty good at that.

I feel like it would be better if people would stop expecting this to be a PVP centered server, and focused on a flavor of PVP that would enhance the current survival situation instead of going against like it often does. Like for years have been saying how PVP is better on other servers... Well of course it will be lol those are PVP focus servers, this is not.
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Or maybe we should realize that the two go hand in hand and hurting the pvp community will hurt the survival community and vice versa. Nobody expects it to be a pvp centered server, but that is the reason that a lot of very dedicated community members are here, and it doesn't make sense to just completely ignore their wants.
 
65jes89 said:
Or maybe we should realize that the two go hand in hand and hurting the pvp community will hurt the survival community and vice versa. Nobody expects it to be a pvp centered server, but that is the reason that a lot of very dedicated community members are here, and it doesn't make sense to just completely ignore their wants.
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That's correct. But I see a lot of people complain with the idea that Massive's PVP isn't like other servers and that's why they're complaining. My point is that, perhaps massive should come up with their own style of PVP that goes better with our own style of factions (which is already different from everything else) instead of trying to make it like other servers that are 100% PVP centered.
 
Conflee said:
Having played one owned by a Cow (not an insult as much as it sounds like one) I can say Massive is 100% not like a HCF server at all. We don't have enough microtransactions or any $400 ranks. Memes aside we are VERY far from that environment. Raiding on here is basically "lets go kill a few dudes until they get bored and sit in their base grinding instead of running into our swords" rather than the Arma3 hardcore serious ops like HCF servers. "We gonna flank in around the side, we have to do this at 5 am so everyone is asleep. They have a guy afk with a second monitor up in a room on their sand walls so if we break the outer sand wall it will trigger a lamp he can see so we have to move fast after the first 2000 distance tnt-wither hybrid canon shot hits. anyone without at least 4 stacks of Gapples is banned"

None of that was exaggeration either is the saddest part.
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And yet that factions experience sounds way more fun
 
Zacatero said:
But I see a lot of people complain with the idea that Massive's PVP isn't like other servers and that's why they're complaining.
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No, you don't. Only a small minority of PvPers voice their opinions on making Massive's PvP closer to other servers. The main suggestions from the PvP community at the moment is adding something we've had before (PvP neutral area that was done previously with KotH) and fixing traits, neither of which take away from Massive's uniqueness.
 
Alj23 said:
In general, you didn't do yourself too many favors by formatting your post to be like the hardest to read thing ever, as well as most of the post being really incoherent and mismatched thoughts just throw onto the page. I'd work on that if you ever want people to take you seriously.
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First of all, totally agree, really struggled with this one.

SubscriptShark said:
have we sat down for a moment and actually adress the REAL problems this community faces instead of doing the same loop over and over till there is no point of return?
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This just shows how out of touch you've been, as ALJ pointed out, you seem to be irritated by the idea of Massive becoming very HCF-like. We've had a fair few meetings in Discord with Staff about what we want and what could potentially be explored- non of which are anything like HCF. Again, as Alj said:
Alj23 said:
but I also think it's ok to experiment with different elements of different play styles seen on other factions servers.
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Again, I agree with ALJ here. In our last meeting staff wanted to discuss the idea of a "core" (LINK), to get around the whole "people are hiding in their bases" problem. We needed an incentive for people to come out, and defend their base, but still give them the option to hide away.

I personally do not see this as straying too far from the Massive playstyle, and as a server, it needs to keep offering solutions and content. This is the most bubble wrapped version of Factions Survival most will ever come to know, and it will continue to be that way, a few extra plugins or features are not going to drastically change that. You're being eccentric.
 
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I don't think you guys understand the difference between factions and HCF...

Also yeah Massive is absolutely nothing like an HCF server
 
Gwyndo said:
I just read up on what HCF was all about and, honestly, it looks really cool.

I'd like to see Massive adopt something like that-- What are your thoughts on it?
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The thing about hcf is that it's, well. Hardcore. I'd say it's safe to assume most factions players aren't up for that playstyle, and also I'm pretty sure hcf maps have to reset all the time.
Massivecraft Factions is generally made up of beautiful builds and lore, in my experience.
 
Lyee said:
The thing about hcf is that it's, well. Hardcore. I'd say it's safe to assume most factions players aren't up for that playstyle, and also I'm pretty sure hcf maps have to reset all the time.
Massivecraft Factions is generally made up of beautiful builds and lore, in my experience.
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That's about right. If we're on the discussion of adding HCF like ideas, then perhaps a world for HCF?
 
Gwyndo said:
I just read up on what HCF was all about and, honestly, it looks really cool.

I'd like to see Massive adopt something like that-- What are your thoughts on it?
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4tv said:
That's about right. If we're on the discussion of adding HCF like ideas, then perhaps a world for HCF?
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HCF servers will always do HCF better than massive, if only because HCF servers are able to run 1.7 (though also for a whole host of other reasons). Furthermore, massive hardly has the population to host a single survival world, let alone two fully separate worlds. That being said, there are certain elements of HCF that would work well with Massive's current setup, such as KoTH, kits, etc.

Contrary to what OP suggests, though, pvpers do not actually want massive turned into a straight HCF. If we wanted to play straight HCF, we would play on an actual HCF server, as many of us do.
 
Lyee said:
Such a thing was an idea years ago. I don't know what ever happened to it. Marty, in a factions meeting, said something about implementing it at as test, but I never saw any outcome.
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I pretty clearly recall that meeting (I didn't know you were there for that) and it was knocked down for the reasons @65jes89 states above, almost to a point. I recall clearly the more pvp-inclined members of gamestaff strongly disagreed with it and preferred that we stick with what is currently going on.
 
4tv said:
I pretty clearly recall that meeting (I didn't know you were there for that) and it was knocked down for the reasons @65jes89 states above, almost to a point. I recall clearly the more pvp-inclined members of gamestaff strongly disagreed with it and preferred that we stick with what is currently going on.
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I've been around since 2011, but uh. Yeah I guess that makes sense why it didn't go through.
 
To be fair HCF having classes is new-ish by a couple years. HCF used to just be custom enchants or over-vanilla enchants, MCMMO out the reer so you had to gapple constantly, and absurdly huge bases. The definition has gotten more and more stupid over time as servers desperately grab for more gimmicks in a vain effort to stay hip and milk more money out of their playerbases. Being slightly behind on what it refers to these days isn't hard.
 
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