Archived Dynmap Default = Off

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Quiggle_Q

Quiggle_Q

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As much as I like hunting the new players due to their ignorance of the dynmap mechanics, I think its possibly bad for new player retention. We want people to enjoy the risk and danger, but also feel like its possible for them to survive in the long run.

Two suggestions:
1 - I'd just like to suggest that dynmap either be part of the starter quest, explaining how it works.

2 - Or just set it default off, unless someone toggles it on.

There is enough going on to learn about, to also have to understand the random messages that suggest you turn it off, lets just turn it off to start with. Some people don't even know what the dynmap is.
 
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I think its a good idea to incorporate it into the starter quest.

But I think its good for a faction to make sure their new recruits turn that off
 
That assumes someone joins a faction right away. Some people join with other real life friends. I just do not see the point in having a default handicap setup for a new player, that they don't even know exists, until they die ... and even then they might not understand.

To be honest, I don't see any reason to have it on by default. Those who disagree probably just want to see the new players die, as they perhaps did ;)

I wonder how many new players leave because of this, thats all I'm concerned about.
 
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Thats what im saying. Some people really enjoy killing unsuspecting noobs. Having it on the optional tutorial in my opinion is better than having it off by default
 
But from a new players perspective, why is it on? To make them an early target? Thats all it achieves. I think it turns away good people in the long run. We want to grow the server, not just give some thrills to the vets at the expensive of what could be a long term member.
 
And don't get me wrong, I think there should be MORE PvP in the game. And people should learn the hard way at times.... but the fact that people are in their bunkers, hiding on the map --- means that the people looking for a fight are most likely going to go after the new players who show up on the map.
 
Honestly, given the huge size of all the maps I would be in favor of dynmap being locked OFF for all players for 1 week since "first played" and ON for ALL OTHER PLAYERS unless they are crouching. As much as I like being able to dig sand for glass in relative safety, I think it would keep me a lot more on my toes if I could be found and attacked at any time, and I would be out attacking other factions more often if I knew they were there.

I think this could even bring balance to the prices in the market a bit, because right now I can make myself Vulnerable to basically everything in traits so that I can have haste2, speed2, jump2 so that digging, mining, building are all ultra fast and easy. If I was always findable, this would be a LOT more dangerous and would maybe make me require guards while harvesting large hunks of raw materials. I say off dynmap for 1 week old or newer members to give them the ability to try and start a faction and/or base without getting killed 15 times a day. And I say off for anybody who is crouching because then ambushes are possible. I can dig my sand and have some ambushers crouching over in the bushes so when a lone PVPer comes to take my sand, we are ready for them.

I definitely agree that the default for dynmap is definitely a deterrent to brand new players. What is more frustrating then joining a server and saying "Cool! The terrain is all clean because of massive restore! Oh I will just explore a bit before joining a faction and getting to work"

*walks out of spawn*

......

*thunder*
 
One of the biggest things to remember is that you have to do /dynmap hide for EACH world. its not universal. SO thats also an issue with noobs
 
Honestly I don't think anyone actually dynmap hunts anymore, so I don't think it matters one way or another unless this
MrTylerGreen said:
Honestly, given the huge size of all the maps I would be in favor of dynmap being locked OFF for all players for 1 week since "first played" and ON for ALL OTHER PLAYERS unless they are crouching. As much as I like being able to dig sand for glass in relative safety, I think it would keep me a lot more on my toes if I could be found and attacked at any time, and I would be out attacking other factions more often if I knew they were there.

I think this could even bring balance to the prices in the market a bit, because right now I can make myself Vulnerable to basically everything in traits so that I can have haste2, speed2, jump2 so that digging, mining, building are all ultra fast and easy. If I was always findable, this would be a LOT more dangerous and would maybe make me require guards while harvesting large hunks of raw materials. I say off dynmap for 1 week old or newer members to give them the ability to try and start a faction and/or base without getting killed 15 times a day. And I say off for anybody who is crouching because then ambushes are possible. I can dig my sand and have some ambushers crouching over in the bushes so when a lone PVPer comes to take my sand, we are ready for them.

I definitely agree that the default for dynmap is definitely a deterrent to brand new players. What is more frustrating then joining a server and saying "Cool! The terrain is all clean because of massive restore! Oh I will just explore a bit before joining a faction and getting to work"

*walks out of spawn*

......

*thunder*
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is implemented (which I do support).
 
I lost half of the group I started with after being hunted when we started playing, none of us had any clue we were the only people visible on the map, being targeted multiple times by other players who knows how many times our betters in terms of equipment was tiring to the extreme. Its very uninspiring to be given a nice assortment of starting equipment only to lose it immediately once you're in world.
 
Antenore said:
I lost half of the group I started with after being hunted when we started playing, none of us had any clue we were the only people visible on the map, being targeted multiple times by other players who knows how many times our betters in terms of equipment was tiring to the extreme. Its very uninspiring to be given a nice assortment of starting equipment only to lose it immediately once you're in world.
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Exactly! Clearly you are still here, and you toughed it out. But good players might not always have the patience, or know that its worthwhile.

The random message that pops up is like "Hey you should hide on dynmap!" ... but people don't necessarily know what that is.
 
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Perhaps it could be added to the holograms that are there when entering each world? I mean then you have clear warnings even if people dont read them.
 
Adding holograms will catch a few players to disable what is honestly a neat feature, but why add an extra step to participating in the dynamic of the server? Why make it so that the server HAS a certain feature that is discouraged from use? Even if it were off by default, that would just make the feature completely void and useless in terms of player locations.

I truly think the only thing that saves dynmap as a useful server feature is removing the players' control over whether you are on it or not. Give new players a reprieve and encourage use from established warring factions.
 
Quiggle_Q said:
Exactly! Clearly you are still here, and you toughed it out. But good players might not always have the patience, or know that its worthwhile.

The random message that pops up is like "Hey you should hide on dynmap!" ... but people don't necessarily know what that is.
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Yeah, my remaining friend and I are fairly patient people when it comes to games, its worth noting that the last player who attacked the both of us actually saw from our gear we dropped that we were new to the server and gave everything back and even lead us back to the small base we founded.

I dont believe I saw any random messages about dynmap, not that I would have known that had anything to do with our plight during that time. Cest'le vie though. Im still enjoying my time on the server.
 
At the moment we cant turn the default to off BUT we will add holograms at world spawns telling people to dynmap hide.
 
Quiggle_Q said:
Awesome, thank you. Hopefully it is something that can be turned off by default in the future.
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The dynmap show and hide are not sharding compatible that is why you have to do it in every world and why we cant turn it off by default.
 
Can't Massive push a command through to the client though?
 
And its hard to see in the screenshot but those stars on top and bottom change color so its VERY hard to miss it.
 
But then the dynmap becomes useless in that aspect. All the experienced players know to turn it off, and if all the new players don't have it on, it becomes extremely difficult if not impossible to locate a faction's main base.

It's a good idea, but unfortunately it takes too much away from pvpers.
 
So only the newbies should be vulnerable, how does that help you find a factions base?
 
Quiggle_Q said:
So only the newbies should be vulnerable, how does that help you find a factions base?
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Lets say Tyberia has 10 cities... one of which would be considered the "main" town where the most people live. If Tyberia has all those cities on different claims. Then its hard to determine which one is worth going to to raid...without seeing people on the map
 
Quiggle_Q said:
So only the newbies should be vulnerable, how does that help you find a factions base?
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You see them on the dynmap, /seen them to see what fac they're in, if it's an enemy or neutral then you've found their land.

Alternatively you could click on the green that pops up while the newbie is walking around and you get all the fac information right there.
 
So, the reason you disagree with my idea, is you believe exploiting new player ignorance is good for the game.
 
Zacatero said:
Lets say Tyberia has 10 cities... one of which would be considered the "main" town where the most people live. If Tyberia has all those cities on different claims. Then its hard to determine which one is worth going to to raid...without seeing people on the map
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Yup, but all the existing players hide, the new people don't know any better do not. Thats what my post is about. If its important for ignorant new players to not do a certain thing, so that you can find existing players to pvp with, then game itself has a problem.
 
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Quiggle_Q said:
So, the reason you disagree with my idea, is you believe exploiting new player ignorance is good for the game.
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Here's a good compromise. Players that are in the wilderness could have dynmap off, but it turns itself back on when they join a faction. At that point they can manually turn it off, but some might not.

This way, people get to track factions down and noobs don't get rekt 15 minutes in.
 
"they can manually turn it off, but some might not. "


So you need new players to come into the game, so you can battle with non-new players? Seems wonky to me. You are saying you are depending on a strange game mechanic, to play pvp at all.
 
I'd be for having the dynmap on 100% of the time for everyone btw. My only complaint is that the ignorant new player is not subjected to overwhelming negative attention due to their ignorance.

I think people should be able to be tracked down, I just don't want it to only be the new players.
 
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I honestly really like the current system, where it's automatically on by default for each server and there are warning Holograms everywhere
 
Zacatero said:
I honestly really like the current system, where it's automatically on by default for each server and there are warning Holograms everywhere
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Some people still don't do it, they don't have context for, or understand what is being warned about.
 
But sometimes people just want to build, or don't want any commotion. If you want it that bad, turn yours on
 
I'm not agreeing with it turning off altogether. I want it to stay the same as it is now.
 
Aespair said:
It's a good idea, but unfortunately it takes too much away from pvpers.
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PvPers aren't the only kind of players out there, you know. They should not be able to have a completely unfair advantage over the random newbie carrying nothing but some bread.

It isn't right to force people to put up with that, over and over. It chases away new players and creates a bad atmosphere. I play Minecraft to have fun and relax, not feel anxious that at any moment I could be assassinated by someone with years' worth of experience and infinitely better tools.

I do think allowing unaligned players to be invisible on the map by default while giving those in factions the choice to be visible is a good idea- those who have aligned with a faction are usually more prepared to handle that sort of attention, or have a group to fall back on if they get attacked/stolen from.
Some random newbie trekking the map with nothing on them but a block of wood or some carrots is probably not looking for that attention and would be best left to their business until they are ready- if they ever choose to be ready.
 
But those are the SURVIVAL WORLDS. This is a conversation that has been had over and over.
 
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