Archived Kell's Vision : Factions Reborn

[Kellock93]

Hey there,

my name is Kellock93 or Kell for short. As you probably know if you clicked this thread the Tech staff is currently working on reevaluating the Factions plugin and reworking it with the long-awaited Empires plugin as a possible result.

Before I left staff a couple weeks before, Game staff were already starting to look through all the different suggestions for the new and improved plugin so before I left I also drafted up some ideas I had on my own and submitted them. Mainly because survival was my main game mode before I became staff and as such, I was really interested in the changes to come.

Now after some weeks have passed I saw a couple other suggestion threads and I noticed that in the end my draft from back then was really vague in some parts and I want to improve on it.

Because I am kinda lazy when it comes to following through with writing up ideas such as this I decided to post it straight to the forums to give me some more motivation to finish it and everyone the option to give feedback at the same time.

The concept involves a lot of different changes so I will make different threads and gather all of them here.

And just as a note from me, some of these ideas are very work intensive so the likelihood of them getting implemented is extremely low, furthermore this is only my vision for how factions could be. So feel free to completely ignore it or disagree with it. As long as it is constructive I appreciate any and all feedback

Kell's Masterplan(Old Version):

PHASE 1/ Factions rework:

• Access rework
• Size and Rank rework
• Relation rework

PHASE 2/ The Split:

• Split between PvP and PvE Worlds
• Empires Expansion: Territorial Control

PHASE 3/ Traits Reborn:

• Traits Expansion
• Upgradable Traits
• MassiveMagic Balance
• Removal of MCMMO

As stated above that is the original draft (without the explanations), I will go through all of these again and adjust them and then post them. They will be linked in the list or crossed out.

 

[Kellock93]

And here we go suggestion No.1, don't mind that I am starting in Phase 2. Phase 1 is simply a lot more to write and the ideas are not really new.

 

[BenRekt]

This is so general I don't know if one can actually have an opinion on it

 

[Kellock93]

Of course it is ... it is the overview after all. I will make threads for all the different steps.

 

[BenRekt]

I will make threads for all the different steps.

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Please just keep it to one post, not to mention the fact that if you've been keeping up with development news, a factions rework is already underway.

 

[Kellock93]

Please just keep it to one post, not to mention the fact that if you've been keeping up with development news, a factions rework is already underway.

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Thank you for not reading the post at all and giving your opinions. If you want to keep doing that go ahead elsewhere, if you actually want to discuss things feel free to come back here, we will happily wait for you.

 

[65jes89]

Thank you for not reading the post at all and giving your opinions. If you want to keep doing that go ahead elsewhere, if you actually want to discuss things feel free to come back here, we will happily wait for you.

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Thank you for not being active at all in the survival/pvp community and giving your opinions while spamming the forums with threads that could easily be made into one :^)

 

[Kellock93]

Thank you for not being active at all in the survival/pvp community and giving your opinions while spamming the forums with threads that could easily be made into one :^)

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You might be right, you might be not. But in any case, I doubt @BenRekt needs you do defend him ^^

 

[BenRekt]

Thank you for not reading the post at all and giving your opinions. If you want to keep doing that go ahead elsewhere, if you actually want to discuss things feel free to come back here, we will happily wait for you.

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You already acknowledged that your thread is so general that you can't even give an opinion on it. Stop being so snarky when you're just spouting general terms and have nothing of actual substance to post besides polarizing ideas like PvE worlds. I find it INSANELY ironic that @Synthesia , on another thread, suggested that those who don't defend themselves should have to surrender and you responded by telling him that his idea would ruin RPers' time on the server. What you suggested in this "outline" and your previous post are just the absolute opposite and just as bad if not worse, just on the other side of the spectrum.

 

[Kellock93]

You already acknowledged that your thread is so general that you can't even give an opinion on it. Stop being so snarky when you're just spouting general terms and have nothing of actual substance to post besides polarizing ideas like PvE worlds. I find it INSANELY ironic that @Synthesia , on another thread, suggested that those who don't defend themselves should have to surrender and you responded by telling him that his idea would ruin RPers' time on the server. What you suggested in this "outline" and your previous post are just the absolute opposite and just as bad if not worse, just on the other side of the spectrum.

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I will ignore the other stuff because besides it simply being wrong, which you would know if you read the post, has no benefit of discussing.

Now regarding the other thread, you seem to be indeed really keen to prove my points over and over. What I said is that it would ruin the fun for people that don't want to fight in the first place. Kinda obvious since they are hiding, no?

But hey, here I am a lonely vigilante fighting for the rights of the poor RPers. Tough I wonder how many of them actually know there even is a survival world.

What I am suggesting in this thread is a general overhaul of the survival world including a lower entry bar to some parts of it to make it more popular again ..... which would actually be PVP.

But hey my evil mind Masterplan is indeed to completely destroy the PVP community and make the RP Weaboo's reign over the complete server, you got me there.

 

[BenRekt]

I will ignore the other stuff because besides it simply being wrong, which you would know if you read the post, has no benefit of discussing.

Now regarding the other thread, you seem to be indeed really keen to prove my points over and over. What I said is that it would ruin the fun for people that don't want to fight in the first place. Kinda obvious since they are hiding, no?

But hey, here I am a lonely vigilante fighting for the rights of the poor RPers. Tough I wonder how many of them actually know there even is a survival world.

What I am suggesting in this thread is a general overhaul of the survival world including a lower entry bar to some parts of it to make it more popular again ..... which would actually be PVP.

But hey my evil mind Masterplan is indeed to completely destroy the PVP community and make the RP Weaboo's reign over the complete server, you got me there.

Click to shrink...

If you honestly think that a PvE world would help PvP in any way, shape, or form you are absolutely delusional. FYI, PvP isn't just tapping your mouse button - it's player interaction. Enemies, alliances, empires, etc. - all that will be effectively destroyed if PvE worlds were implemented - though I'm not actually worried that they will be, considering how many negative effects it would have on the longevity of the server.

You are literally saying PvP will be improved by offering players the ability to completely avoid it once and for all - which they can do already at a minor inconvenience (surrender, which nobody uses, or just waiting in Regalia for the raiders to leave). And of course I don't think you've formulated some master plan to destroy PvP - I just pointed out why your logic is extremely flawed and why you are wrong.

 

[BenRekt]

I will ignore the other stuff because besides it simply being wrong, which you would know if you read the post, has no benefit of discussing.

Now regarding the other thread, you seem to be indeed really keen to prove my points over and over. What I said is that it would ruin the fun for people that don't want to fight in the first place. Kinda obvious since they are hiding, no?

But hey, here I am a lonely vigilante fighting for the rights of the poor RPers. Tough I wonder how many of them actually know there even is a survival world.

What I am suggesting in this thread is a general overhaul of the survival world including a lower entry bar to some parts of it to make it more popular again ..... which would actually be PVP.

But hey my evil mind Masterplan is indeed to completely destroy the PVP community and make the RP Weaboo's reign over the complete server, you got me there.

Click to shrink...

Also, if you're going to respond, at least have something to back up what you've said instead of trying to mock people for disagreeing with you. The only point you attempted to make was that you were somehow "lowering the bar" for entry into PvP (which is just simply wrong - if PvE worlds are there, nobody will have any reason to go to the PvP-enabled worlds). Over half of your response is completely irrelevant, talking about how I must think you are some mastermind trying to destroy PvP. Maybe if there was some actual substance in your posts, we could have a constructive conversation.

 

[Zacatero]

Okay lets get one thing straight.

@BenRekt it helps absolutely nobody when we immediately shoot down ideas. And by the way, lets not shoot down a thread just because the OP doesnt play factions much. Because i dont know if you thought about it before giving your input, but its the people who are like him that we want!!! We want to appeal to those who ARENT ALREADY IN SURVIVAL! And trust me i love PVP. But we wont get ANYTHING done if we try to make it better. Because what is going to be the best case scenario is that we fix factions, and then a style of PVP that is appropriate to Massive's survival worlds will come to it. It makes no sense to try to pick out the cabinet sizes when you have no idea how big the kitchen is gonna be.

 

[BenRekt]

Okay lets get one thing straight.

@BenRekt it helps absolutely nobody when we immediately shoot down ideas. And by the way, lets not shoot down a thread just because the OP doesnt play factions much. Because i dont know if you thought about it before giving your input, but its the people who are like him that we want!!! We want to appeal to those who ARENT ALREADY IN SURVIVAL! And trust me i love PVP. But we wont get ANYTHING done if we try to make it better. Because what is going to be the best case scenario is that we fix factions, and then a style of PVP that is appropriate to Massive's survival worlds will come to it. It makes no sense to try to pick out the cabinet sizes when you have no idea how big the kitchen is gonna be.

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tbh I don't even need to shoot this idea down myself, I can almost guarantee it will just get out-right denied by staff as soon as they actually review it.

 

[Zacatero]

tbh I don't even need to shoot this idea down myself, I can almost guarantee it will just get out-right denied by staff as soon as they actually review it.

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And that very well may happen.

Lol i mean im the one who's banned here and im still giving more productive and constructive input than a lot of yall on these threads. Lets just keep it calm and lets try to wait until we get more info on the faction's expansions because there is an excellent chance that a good portion of these threads will be dated and obsolete when we get new info.

 

[Kellock93]

If you honestly think that a PvE world would help PvP in any way, shape, or form you are absolutely delusional. FYI, PvP isn't just tapping your mouse button - it's player interaction. Enemies, alliances, empires, etc. - all that will be effectively destroyed if PvE worlds were implemented - though I'm not actually worried that they will be, considering how many negative effects it would have on the longevity of the server.

You are literally saying PvP will be improved by offering players the ability to completely avoid it once and for all - which they can do already at a minor inconvenience (surrender, which nobody uses, or just waiting in Regalia for the raiders to leave). And of course I don't think you've formulated some master plan to destroy PvP - I just pointed out why your logic is extremely flawed and why you are wrong.

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I really like how people argue around here, they take a statement someone else made and bend it to make it suit their purpose.

But we want to have a discussion here so let's get started. You are indeed right, some of the things you mentioned like enemies, alliances and empires will loose their worth in a PVE world, but that doesn't mean they will disappear. They will be simply be replaced by other social groups most likely being neighbor factions and such.

What I am wondering about is why you think it would have an effect on the longevity of the server, or were you talking about the relations between factions there?

Now to the bending word part, I did not say it will improve PVP, I said it has a chance to improve the PVP player base size wise through an overall bigger player base for survival. And according to various suggestions that are plaguing the forums for weeks now, that was supposed to be one of the main issues of our esteemed PVPers.

(which is just simply wrong - if PvE worlds are there, nobody will have any reason to go to the PvP-enabled worlds)

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I just picked me a little gem out of that post, so you are saying most people actually don't want to fight?
Why else would they leave the PVP worlds?

Also what exactly do you want me to back up? I am more than happy to do so and even happier to have a constructive discussion, but then with the same rules for both sides ^^

 

[BenRekt]

I really like how people argue around here, they take a statement someone else made and bend it to make it suit their purpose.

But we want to have a discussion here so let's get started. You are indeed right, some of the things you mentioned like enemies, alliances and empires will loose their worth in a PVE world, but that doesn't mean they will disappear. They will be simply be replaced by other social groups most likely being neighbor factions and such.

What I am wondering about is why you think it would have an effect on the longevity of the server, or were you talking about the relations between factions there?

Now to the bending word part, I did not say it will improve PVP, I said it has a chance to improve the PVP player base size wise through an overall bigger player base for survival. And according to various suggestions that are plaguing the forums for weeks now, that was supposed to be one of the main issues of our esteemed PVPers.



I just picked me a little gem out of that post, so you are saying most people actually don't want to fight?
Why else would they leave the PVP worlds?

Also what exactly do you want me to back up? I am more than happy to do so and even happier to have a constructive discussion, but then with the same rules for both sides ^^

Click to shrink...

I know "longevity" is a general term, so I'll explain it a bit. I think if you ask people why they play, especially older players like you and myself, you'll find most people stayed because they met other players and formed relationships with them because the server used to have a lot more player interaction due to the lack of a safe zone like Regalia. When you allow people to play in a PvE environment, you remove any potential meaningful player interaction because meeting someone isn't all that important if they present no threat - not to mention they have no choice over whether they want to be friendly or hostile - they are forced to be 'friendly' or at the very least just passive. The best relationships I've formed on this server are from a) people attacking me and then befriending them or b) defending random players from a threat. As I said, removing PvP removes potential alliances, enemies, etc. and in general would decrease player interaction - which is one of the reasons this server offers (more like 'offered' at this point) such a unique experience that had dedicated players always coming back for more.

You say "bigger player base for survival" but I think even you know that's mostly a pipe dream. Nobody is going to start up in a PvE world and just suddenly decide that they would now enjoy being under threat from other players - they chose to set up in the PvE world for a reason - that is that they would not have any threat of being attacked. Survival worlds SHOULD be at least somewhat harsh, and MassiveMobs and 'PvE' is not going to offer an engaging experience besides for the occasional builder who decides to build a city and then never visits it again (as you can already see in the current survival worlds).

I wanted you to back up your point about how a PvE world would somehow improve and encourage a larger PvP community - because as I've just explained I don't see how anyone would think that could be the case.

 

[Nexdy]

I really like how people argue around here, they take a statement someone else made and bend it to make it suit their purpose.

But we want to have a discussion here so let's get started. You are indeed right, some of the things you mentioned like enemies, alliances and empires will loose their worth in a PVE world, but that doesn't mean they will disappear. They will be simply be replaced by other social groups most likely being neighbor factions and such.

What I am wondering about is why you think it would have an effect on the longevity of the server, or were you talking about the relations between factions there?

Now to the bending word part, I did not say it will improve PVP, I said it has a chance to improve the PVP player base size wise through an overall bigger player base for survival. And according to various suggestions that are plaguing the forums for weeks now, that was supposed to be one of the main issues of our esteemed PVPers.



I just picked me a little gem out of that post, so you are saying most people actually don't want to fight?
Why else would they leave the PVP worlds?

Also what exactly do you want me to back up? I am more than happy to do so and even happier to have a constructive discussion, but then with the same rules for both sides ^^

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Kellock, what you've suggested so far has all relied on a PVE world. A PVE world seems useless to me personally, i could tell you that you have some good ideas but their are so many holes in your "idea" that it seems pointless to even call it good. for one why would i play in a PVE faction world when their are zero risks and no PVP, if they did this it wouldn't just ruin the PVP community but economy and even the survival experience in general. people would have no use in buying stuff because they have no reason too their not buying things to fight, their not brewing potions, their not making armor and their surely not gonna make god gear. the survival/multiplayer experience is meant for human interaction which includes PVP. my second point is if we made a two worlds or a split as you called it Massivecraft is telling PVpers that their community is useless to them and they should just quit. If that's what the idea is then sure make a PVE world but don't even bother with a PVP world Cause you're right most roleplayers would most likely go to the PVE world to make a faction because why build a city in danger when i could coward in a no PVP world.

 

[Winterless]

"Remove MCMMO"

Yeah bye

Lemme tell you something mate

The only people that advocate for the removal of MCMMO don't play Survival or PvP
:>

 

[65jes89]

"Remove MCMMO"

Yeah bye

Lemme tell you something mate

The only people that advocate for the removal of MCMMO don't play Survival or PvP
:>

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Me and Ben have both advocated for that in the past, at least the pvp parts. Guessing we have completely different reasons, though.