Archived Education For Foreigners

[Markisbeest]

On the wiki there's several skills in which seem to only be available for those born and raised within the Empire of Regalia. I think this offers a loss of opportunities towards those who have immigrated from other states with significant political development, which I would imagine being the Inheritor States, the Masaya and the Chi'en Ji state whose name currently eludes me. To a lesser degree this could also be applied to other states and nations, see below for specific examples.

Before I start to give specific suggestions, I realise there's a certain bureaucracy in place in the Regalian Empire that is not found in other nations in the world. I respect this, and I realise it will have a distinctive effect on the options of education one may have in the world. Regardless, this should offer variety and boons to education within the Regalian Empire and not exclusive rights to education.

I do at the same time record that one could always say I was in fact educated in this and this, but for the purposes of streamlining, making certain aspects are not under or overpoweredly abused in rp and the purposes of said skills being utilised within world progression events and the like, I would still suggest these current additions.

Please do note that I am not an expert on lore and certainly not on all nations and cultures listed below, so consider these suggestions, and if there is a valid reason for such skills to not be known due to a culture based attempt, do please take into consideration the entirety of what I am trying to accomplish here, and not simply the word for word variety as below.

My suggestions:

Combat schools:

Spoiler: see here

Combat schools in general are rather well thought out. There are several schools that are limited or highly encouraged to be learned in different parts of the world. Aside from the wish for more schools, which I realise is a lot of work for likely a very niche group of players I would suggest adding a few varieties to some of the already existing schools.

Siegwald: Near all civilised nations presumably use banners. Perhaps an OOC note can be added that similar fighting style can be learned within the Inheritor States, the Masaya and the Ch'ien Ji state, but it isn't nearly as well thought out and could only reach say Warrior level.

Tenpenny: A note already exists at the bottom. Perhaps specifications on what nations or a boundary to what level can be reached can be added.

Drixon: Presumably the Regalian Empire is not the only state with a trained cavalry, or at least trained cavalry core. Perhaps the other larger states may have a variety on these studies capping at fighter or warrior level. With a slight increase in time added, since the schools are not as supported or used as others. Perhaps also add a comparison to Avanthar and what they could accomplish, to make a fair comparison, though Avant and Ularen do make up for this in the most part.

Other than this, in my opinion the schools are well-balanced and spread out, offering only a tiny bit of an edge towards regalia, which is completely justifyable.

Intellect schools:

Spoiler: see here

Intellect schools form a bit of a sore point in my opinion. They are generally well fleshed out, and make sense, but completely disregard the ability of other nations to teach a similar skill.

Visual Arts and Culinary Arts: These schools are focused solely on regalian institutes, perhaps an OOC note regarding other nations, especially I feel the Ch'ien Ji and the Inheritor States would still actively pursue such things. It can even be added that due to the cultural differences the rank attained in said foreign institute would always be lowered by one in practicality in Regalia.

Statesmanship: I feel like the statesmanship schools with the exception of law, realm statesmanship and seminary should all be available to every significantly civilised and prosperous nation. Perhaps add a minor ooc limitation that due to the differences in on how it is capped at a lower level, due to cultural differences, but still takes a similar graduation time. I imagine even in the dwarven holds there's people studied in commerce and banking, though that may be a racial stereotype *winkyface*
Law would be the same, but completely unapplicable, since laws are different in every state.
Realm Statesmanship I feel might come to play in some nations. I imagine however that all other nations would simply rely on the 20 years of practice rule instead of actually teaching it. Nonetheless it should likely be attainable for aristocracy and nobility of other nations.
Seminary is fine.

Leadership: There are other nations with a military. These nations are less exceptional in their militarism, so they should be less effective and not quite recognised as valid by the majority of people, but the system should see these as lesser degrees of the same school. Perhaps have an OOC note that the applicable skill would always be practically bannership, but a studious way for non-ailor to attain a leadership position should be available. Especially for a songaskian, or an elf. At least that's how I feel about it.

Bannership: Here I'd like to suggest the opposite. Male Ailor should be able to attain bannership through service within the regalian army aswell.

Science Schools are all very well balanced, I think.

Magic education is well diversified.

Other notes:

Spoiler: see here

Additionally I'd like to suggest, that especially for the Inheritor states, and other elven nations, that the graduation and education times are doubled. Elves live long, and as such I imagine the people having the money for education would take note of this and spread out the workload, especially since time is not much of a hinderance for them.

These are my suggestions, feel free to give your opinions on them, or discuss below.

 

[FireFan96]

Tenpenny is considered "basic combat training" and the fighting style is applicable to various fighters. It may not be called Tenpenny, but it does the same job.

Leadership also is a Regalian invention, as other nations have different styles of combat leadership. Bannership could be extended a bit, but for the most part the upper general schools would be useless (since said generals are in Farahdeen and would never be in Regalia to begin with)

besides some of those notes, I'd be happy to see a few schools expanded to other races, or have race exclusive intellect schools of sorts (combat seems fairly diverse now so all that is needed is some brain schools)

 

[ZZaque]

Hello.


Regalia is unique in that it provides many differing combat schools to all walks of people.

In many of the other states, from a gameplay perspective, their life focuses on other things outside of combat and thus are not as varied and are not as inclusive when it comes to combat skills (as you eluded to). Many of the other races mentioned are not combat oriented at all. The Chien-ji are philosophers and astronomists, they have no need to fight, the Masaya uses slaves to fight their battles, and the Elves use magic for the most part.

Even if immigrating to the Regalian Empire, the races were not built for those niches, and thus, why play a ripped Turall Elf when you can have the same exact thing when you make an Ailor minus pointy ears.

Plus private tutors are a thing.

 

[Eccetra]

On the topic of intellect schools I actually think you have brought up a very valid point. Remind me to come back to this later I forget.

 

[Reaganism]

Leadership also is a Regalian invention, as other nations have different styles of combat leadership. Bannership could be extended a bit, but for the most part the upper general schools would be useless (since said generals are in Farahdeen and would never be in Regalia to begin with)

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I always found that point somewhat moot. Knowledge isn't something you can "safeguard", especially not if you face elves & competent races. I'd reckon the moment a new military doctrine is developed by Regalia, it'll be dissected and researched two weeks afterwards in the Masaya and the Inheritor States. The leadership page does not specify what aspects of military doctrine are unique to the Regalian army but I'd reckon the Elves and the Qadir would not be far behind, merely a couple years "old" with their own doctrines.

 

[Markisbeest]

Tenpenny is considered "basic combat training" and the fighting style is applicable to various fighters. It may not be called Tenpenny, but it does the same job.

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If this is so, then it should be rather easy to put an OOC note down to say the equivalent may be found within other states and can be learned there at the same or a lower cap, solving the problem, is what I'm trying to say.

Leadership also is a Regalian invention, as other nations have different styles of combat leadership. Bannership could be extended a bit, but for the most part the upper general schools would be useless (since said generals are in Farahdeen and would never be in Regalia to begin with)

Click to shrink...

As @Miss_Ortonnaise points out, I think there's leadership skills to be found in other places of the world regardless, and I am very fine with keeping those at an effective level of bannership at the cap, since they are likely very different in style, but regardless you can't say leadership is a regalian invention. As in lore there's an entire military dictatorship within the inheritor states, the Masaya is also a wartorn state with a genuine upper class of leaders coordinating the actions of massive slave armies and I can probably pull a few other examples if I really looked into it.
As for your point of said generals would always be in Regalia anyway, that completely rules out upperclass turncoats for any reason, political, cultural or religious, and I really like turncoats, seeing as I play one currently.

Even if immigrating to the Regalian Empire, the races were not built for those niches, and thus, why play a ripped Turall Elf when you can have the same exact thing when you make an Ailor minus pointy ears.

Click to shrink...

As I said in the above post, I do agree that Ailor and Regalia should by far have the upper hand, due to their variable builds and militarism, but to say they cannot fight, or in the case of the elves for example all use Atraves of bows is simply a very weird way to look at it. The elves regardless of whether they can use lots of fighting schools can field massive armies. Surely those aren't all mages, or else the cataclysm wouldn't have had such a big impact after all on the elven empire. And of course there doesn't need to be an option for all of the schools to be playable or have an equivalent, but I find it very hard to believe that the Altalar armies don't have a cavalry division, or that their entire infantry uses a specialised old royal guard technique of fighting.


That said, thank you for all the replies so far^^

 

[ZZaque]

And of course there doesn't need to be an option for all of the schools to be playable or have an equivalent, but I find it very hard to believe that the Altalar armies don't have a cavalry division, or that their entire infantry uses a specialised old royal guard technique of fighting.

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There's not a point in writing the same school three times but switching out Ailor for Nelfin and then Nelfin for Songaskia. They probably do have those things but it's pointless to write the same book three times. Each combat school fills a niche and accommodates the niche of the race.

 

[Reaganism]

There's not a point in writing the same school three times but switching out Ailor for Nelfin and then Nelfin for Songaskia. They probably do have those things but it's pointless to write the same book three times. Each combat school fills a niche and accommodates the niche of the race.

Click to shrink...

I think the main argument here is to create disciples and combat schools that are semi-universal between races and armies allowing for foreign members, instead of specifying them into one institution. Or to add "variants" below any combat school to make them more versatile and applicable. EG, add a note to Drixon that there is an equivalent school in Rie, though it's not taught in an academy but on the field.

 

[Wumpatron]

This is one factor that should be considered at all times, the focus of the server narrative and the entirety of the lore is the Regalian Empire. Everything else is a supplement and add on to further this narrative, but the main focus is on Empire itself and the lore is a reflection of this. We simply cannot and see no purpose in creating combat and military structures for every nation and army when it will not be pertinent for role play at all.

If you have any specific inconsistencies in the lore or wonder what a race can claim then I will do my best to answer them on this thread. Understand that my responses may cover more than one field and I will not repeat answer things that were addressed already.

 

[Markisbeest]

I'm not saying that there should be three variations of every school, and I agree that it should be focused on the Regalian Empire setting. But to say add a note in the OOC section saying:
"Similar training is available in the following states: listlistlist, however due to cultural militarism in the Regalian Empire, these trainings are in comparison capped at the level of Fighter."

It would not require much work, keep the focus on the Regalian Empire by keeping the higher levels strictly Regalian-learned only. And in return it would also add some flavour and options for niche roleplay from immigrant characters.
The only point that I see against it would honestly be that more options would become available and non-ailor rp would become a bigger thing, though I am personally doubtful that would happen.

 

[Wumpatron]

That extra sentence is not entirely necessary as it can be viewed on a case by case basis in character reviews, just no one tries to make it fit. I see no game breaking meta with being a footman from a comparable army and using a combat school to justify it. The issues show up when players try and explain what that army was like, what numbers they had, weapons, etc. when they wouldn't have that sort of knowledge. Meta information becomes an issue when players overextend the boundaries of the lore to make them special or desirable wells of information IG.

So in short, you can have everything you want, you just have to draw it from what exists and never assume that an army has something when the lore doesn't explicitly say that it does. Such as an Elven Calvary. And even then, if a character is not permitted to claim they are from a certain nation, then default back to it being self inserted meta information on things they are quite literally making up because "my character was from there"

 

[Markisbeest]

On the topic of intellect schools I actually think you have brought up a very valid point. Remind me to come back to this later I forget.

Click to shrink...

You asked for a reminder

 

[Reaganism]

I think a fair compromise would be to allow players to "make up" intellect schools if they'd in-lore exist in their respective states? And then these can be judged on a case-by-case basis, following same rules as the Regalian schools.

EG, of course studying law would be irrelevant if it was done in Rie. But for example, allow players to claim their character studied finance in the Masaya. Or subterfuge in Rie.