Archived Economy Repair

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Savantly

Savantly

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= The fight to Repair the Economy from fishing. =
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As some of us older maybe Veteran players know, fishing has taken an extreme toll on the server economy. People went from having a stack of diamonds to having a stack of diamond blocks. In order to Push the prices up we need money sinks on the server. As some are aware there are already a couple of these. And i will post mine own thread links on this forum thread. Please give me support and offer new ways to lift the economy back up. If i find that i agree with your threads i will link them in this thread.

It is a given that some people who are reading this now are going to disagree with some ideas that I support, but that is not what this thread is about. This thread is intended for you to go check out other neat ideas and get them implemented.

Just one more thing that i must point out.. Any ideas that are successful will be able to create more options for players to do things on massivecraft. So please Shout out your ideas <3

(Some thread links may not seem like they will help out server economy, but trust me i think they could help the economy more than you think)

If any of the forums threads below are locked or become locked just let me know.
~Inform me if you have any hyperlink issues~

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= Server Money sinks already in effect =
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Faction Warzones
Factions
Regalian houses/shops
Lwc locks

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= Money sinks that i would wish to happen =
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Faction Power Boost
Item Lore 1
Item Lore 2
Item Lore 3
Empires
Faction Price Raise 1
Faction Price Raise 2

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= Ideas that can create new places in the market =
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Arrow Types
God Apples
Player Heads
Xp Bottles 1
Xp Bottles 2
Spears
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= Random Cool Ideas (kinda off track but.. Hey) =
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Sword PvP Expansion
Armour Weight
Faction Jail
Magic
Killer Squids
Sleep Whenever
Raid Alert
Expanded Wars Pluggin

Post below if you have any ideas or if you need any Threads supported.

~Thread Edit 1 Complete~
 
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Something does need to be done about the economy...wayyyy to easy to get regals now adays..
 
I personally don't think just Money sinks are the answer
For example the diamond supply is ridiculous. 1r per diamond
There need to be large money sinks in addition to scarcer natural resources in my opinion.
 
Mecharic said:
This isn't an ailing economy... prices are low, which means only that Regals aren't valued very highly. All it takes to increase the value of Regals, which have no inherent value or use, is to change the perspective of the value of Regals. That is, if everyone sold diamond for 20 regals a diamond that would be the value of Regals. So do not ask the server to fix something that isn't technically broken.
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It is not broken, but it is almost hit Rock bottom. If you do not care about the economy then I would kindly ask you to remove yourself from my thread. Inflation is Super high, Now if you want to argue about that then you have simply lost your mind.
I respect you, but please do not degrade the ideas on the post.
 
Hey,
first of all thumbs up for the effort you put into this thread. Secondly i agree to some point with Mecharic's view of things. It is not the fault of the whole server, that the money or better the value of regals are sometimes low and on another time very high. It depends on the players how they trade with valuable items, which set the value for regals. There's no agreement of the players which fix the prices of valuable and non-valuable items. This leads to an unstable economy, not an ailing one.

Well, if the result of this thread will get us to set a fixed pricelist (atm there's only one Empire approved if im correct?) of the said values, we are able to stabilize the economy in the Regalian empire. But its not bad atm if your experienced with the server. For newcomers its very difficult to understand how things work on this server.

If, in the near future, some new Empires rises beside Regalia (RP-approved) this fixed pricelist would be pointless, they will set their own pricelist with their own currency. Therefore, those lists won't be able to set fix prices, they will always change from time to time to adjust to the worldwide economy of aloria. Just like in RL. So, in the end, its hard to say how do you want to "repair economy" by just putting some ideas together. But for now i like your passion for this topic.

I'm very interested in which way this thread will end, so you will get my voice for that, i guess.

Here's an economysystem theory, maybe it's good for the MassiveCraft communitiy;)
 
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I have a couple ideas, but I don't really care enough about mc to bother making a new thread.

You could make a buy/sell admin shop and remove the market.
In case that doesn't go through I think a great money sink and something builders miss, would be to create a admin shop where you can buy the decoration blocks used in regalia.
Something I think would be nice and kindof miss would be to create new coins, such as copper, silver, gold but with massivecrafts own identity such as regals. A thread could be made to figure out names etc.
 
pokyug said:
If you believe that "There is nothing wrong with the low currency value." Such belief will Cause a complete Rock bottom hit to the economy. Then you most assuredly do not care about the Economy. Now If you want to State An opinion that actually helps people then feel free, Otherwise your just producing Toxic information.
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1)You keep saying that the economy will hit rock bottom if the currency value remains low. Could you please explain what this "rock bottom" is, and why a low currency value would cause this?
2) Toxic information? What the heck is that?
3) If you're going to fling accusations, at least give some backing. Don't just say "YOU DON'T CARE ABOUT THE ECONOMY! I'M RIGHT AND YOU'RE WRONG!"
 
TheFinitePeach said:
I personally don't think just Money sinks are the answer
For example the diamond supply is ridiculous. 1r per diamond
There need to be large money sinks in addition to scarcer natural resources in my opinion.
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You do prove a valid point, and i also supported this statement by placing a "Ideas that can create new places in the market" Section.
 
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favoured said:
1)You keep saying that the economy will hit rock bottom if the currency value remains low. Could you please explain what this "rock bottom" is, and why a low currency value would cause this?
2) Toxic information? What the heck is that?
3) If you're going to fling accusations, at least give some backing. Don't just say "YOU DON'T CARE ABOUT THE ECONOMY! I'M RIGHT AND YOU'RE WRONG!"
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Dare i need to explain it? Rock bottom is Exactly what Mecharic has stated. Rock bottom is "if people stopped accepting Regals as a form of currency that would be breaking the economy. If people stopped trading, that would be breaking the economy."
 
@Mecharic @favoured
Stop with the Arguing, Read the Subject. I even stated for people of your wit that "It is a given that some people who are reading this now are going to disagree with some ideas that I support, but that is not what this thread is about. This thread is intended for you to go check out other neat ideas and get them implemented."
So Be respectful, Stop arguing, and use the Thread for what i had intended.
 
Well, i think pokyug intends his thread as just a new form of subforum, for people who are interested into the servers economy and summarize all econonmy related threads in here with their own classification, so players have a nice easy straightforward spreadsheet about this. If they want to support or add new threads like the listed ones above, they can easily click on them. He doesnt say the economy is broken or something like that in his thread. He just said his opinion about the economy and he wants to improve it this way.

If you guys know this already, please excuse me and ignore this comment ;)
 
Loewe2011 said:
Well, i think pokyug intends his thread as just a new form of subforum, for people who are interested into the servers economy and summarize all econonmy related threads in here with their own classification, so players have a nice easy straightforward spreadsheet about this. If they want to support or add new threads like the listed ones above, they can easily click on them. He doesnt say the economy is broken or something like that in his thread. He just said his opinion about the economy and he wants to improve it this way.

If you guys know this already, please excuse me and ignore this comment ;)
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Better worded than I could have hoped to word it myself. :D thank you for understanding.
 
Made_By said:
This thread was made my thewaymaker a year and a bit ago. This is not disagreeing with your points @pokyug but giving people a chance to have different opinions on what could be done http://forums.massivecraft.com/threads/why-the-massivecraft-economy-is-not-broken.3575/
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I do find myself agreeing with aspects that TheWayMaker pointed out. Infact the whole idea of this thread is purely based off of the need for more active economists, and so we have more things to spend our regals on.
 
Made_By said:
Well actually straight away mecharic shut pokyug down with his first comment.
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Mecharic offered him information on the topic he made the thread about. You can't post anything in the Feature and idea discussion category and expect people to not differ with you or have a their own opinion, which may or may not be the same as your own. This thread and the public's ability to disagree with its topic is no different than anyone else's.
 
I will now delete all of my former posts, as they were slightly off (which was my mistake). Here is the information as it stands:

2 Regals = 1 Diamond - this means both that diamonds have low value AND that Regals have high value. Imagine buying a diamond with 1 US Dollar. Pretty cool right? Except for the seller. Now, what the USA does in that sort of situation is print more dollars so that the value of the dollar drops in relation to ALL OTHER ITEMS. So what REALLY needs to be done is that the server would need to add more Regals to the system so that each Regal is worth less to players. Bad for buyers, good for sellers.

As Regals become rarer their respective value increases in relation to all other items. Add more Regals to raise prices.
 
Mecharic said:
I will now delete all of my former posts, as they were slightly off (which was my mistake). Here is the information as it stands:

2 Regals = 1 Diamond - this means both that diamonds have low value AND that Regals have high value. Imagine buying a diamond with 1 US Dollar. Pretty cool right? Except for the seller. Now, what the USA does in that sort of situation is print more dollars so that the value of the dollar drops in relation to ALL OTHER ITEMS. So what REALLY needs to be done is that the server would need to add more Regals to the system so that each Regal is worth less to players. Bad for buyers, good for sellers.

As Regals become rarer their respective value increases in relation to all other items. Add more Regals to raise prices.
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Or you could set a default price for each item through a admin shop or make diamond sinks(such as removing "fix" or making tweaks to the mcmmo repair). There is an insane amount of material wealth and I don't feel like there is as much trade going on as there once. I "personally" don't think it's worth selling stuff atm and I believe a lot of people feels the same way.

Filling the economy with more money is what got us where we are today with premium, quest and vote silver. Not sure what your solution is, but that was what I understood.
 
Dam94 said:
Or you could set a default price for each item through a admin shop or make diamond sinks(such as removing "fix" or making tweaks to the mcmmo repair). There is an insane amount of material wealth and I don't feel like there is as much trade going on as there once. I "personally" don't think it's worth selling stuff atm and I believe a lot of people feels the same way.

Filling the economy with more money is what got us where we are today with premium, quest and vote silver. Not sure what your solution is, but that was what I understood.
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Actually the increase in money is NOT what got us here - the raw amount of materials for sale is what got us here. Adding regals lowers their value because more people have regals in respect to other items. Removing regals increases their value because people have more items per regal than they did earlier.
 
One great way to make diamonds more valuable is too 1. Bring back the insane armor damage from Axes 2. Nerf/Remove ./fix command for Prems
 
Honestly, out of all the possible sinks my favorites are the ones related to creating player lore items, and the faction power boosts.
The main reasons being that they are nice enough that they would used often, which would make them effective, and that it would be beneficial to many (if not most) parties affected by this. Regals are removed from circulation, which would hopefully would give them more value, and people get cool things and benefits which is good most of the time.
Furthermore, it creates sinks without making life harder for new factions, which is also (if not equally) important. We shouldn't create fixes to issues by making new players work that much harder to make a faction, which is already fairly hard at the moment. If we make life harder for them, then we are more than likely going to see a decrease in new players sticking with the server.
Naturally these are opinions, but I feel that they are validated by good reason and logic. If you do feel that the only way to fix the economy is by making life really hard for new players, then by all means say I am wrong.
 
TheFinitePeach said:
One great way to make diamonds more valuable is too 1. Bring back the insane armor damage from Axes 2. Nerf/Remove ./fix command for Prems
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Axe armor damage is already crazy high. You can't fight against anyone on the /mctop 5 for axes or higher for longer than 10 minutes without your armor being shredded.
 
Thank your for putting my post in here!
 
So, what I'm hearing is..We must make it rain on the poor. *rubs right hand over my left hand to simulate the experience of throwing regals at people* Then again I just wanted to do that. Though, the economy does not bother me as I grow, or mine what I have. Nor do I sell these. I just wanted to make it rain for five seconds. :3
 
Mecharic said:
Actually the increase in money is NOT what got us here - the raw amount of materials for sale is what got us here. Adding regals lowers their value because more people have regals in respect to other items. Removing regals increases their value because people have more items per regal than they did earlier.
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Then adding money sinks would have a negative effect. But as of now I think there is too many regals in the system and that the solution should either be to increase the value on materials (sinks such as the ones I mentioned in my other post) or create a admin shop, setting the prices for if not every item then the items that is currently flooding the market.
 
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Dam94 said:
Then adding money sinks would have a negative effect. But as of now I think there is too many regals in the system and that the solution should either be to increase the value on materials (sinks such as the ones I mentioned in my other post) or create a admin shop, setting the prices for if not every item then the items that is currently flooding the market.

On a side note I still believe making more coins would have a great effect on the server.
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I don't understand what you're saying. You start off with saying that you think there's too much regals in the system. Then end it by saying making more coins would have a great effect on the server. An admin shop would increase the amount of regals in the system as well.

And if you take away regals from the system, you will get less regals per material sold. You seem to think that more regals makes item costs lower.
 
Dam94 said:
Then adding money sinks would have a negative effect. But as of now I think there is too many regals in the system and that the solution should either be to increase the value on materials (sinks such as the ones I mentioned in my other post) or create a admin shop, setting the prices for if not every item then the items that is currently flooding the market.

On a side note I still believe making more coins would have a great effect on the server.
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Are you trying to raise or lower prices? Adding more Regals(coins) will raise prices, so if the goal is to raise prices you would want to add more Regals. If the goal is to lower prices, remove regals so that their value goes up.
 
i don't understand a lot of all this talk so don't kill me for saying this but i think it needs to go 2 way's. adding a litle more money in the system and raise your prices. as i see it now is that people sell some stuf whay to low becouse otherwise no one woulb buy it becouse other people sell it for lower, if everyone rasied it price then the buyer's have no choice but to pay the higher price unles they wan't to gather it all thesmelves.
damn i am bad in explaining my point but i think it's clear what i am trieng to say here?
 
What I want to say is that changing the amount of regals doesn't do anything about the amount of materials out there. The problem is a market flooded by valuable items that are close to worthless and not worth the bother to sell. If we add more or remove regals it changes nothing but the numbers, the items will still have the "same value". @Mecharic @Nordhbane
 
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Alj23 said:
Axe armor damage is already crazy high. You can't fight against anyone on the /mctop 5 for axes or higher for longer than 10 minutes without your armor being shredded.
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That the point. Probably the highest, or one of the highest, uses of diamonds is Armor. You make it so that armor needs to be replaced more often or repaired more often you increase the demand for diamonds. Increased demand = Increased value.

Mecharic said:
Are you trying to raise or lower prices? Adding more Regals(coins) will raise prices, so if the goal is to raise prices you would want to add more Regals. If the goal is to lower prices, remove regals so that their value goes up.
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What I think would be the best for the economy is to reduce the amount of regals in circulation and remove the amount of certain resources in circulation. Mostly diamonds.
 
I feel that removing regals from the server isn't necessarly what would fix the economy. As you stated the problem is that people gathered massive amounts of valuables. So instead of a money sink, perhaps a resource sink. As an example, if /fix was removed or lessened, people would need to spend time/resources/experience to fix enchanted things, thereby helping drain treasure from the overall economy. And yes, we would all hate the world for removing /fix (I for one have over a double chest of damaged armor I still need to fix), but I feel it would be a good way to help drain diamonds from the server.
 
Reducing the amount of regals in circulation, as Mech stated, wouldnt cause inflation. It'd cause deflation. It wont make items go down anymore in price then they already are. It'd just make people poorer. Then Massive'd be in a "recession" of sorts. However, the economy in massive is technically great. Everything is super cheap, regals have a lot of value to them. You can buy diamonds with pocket change. God weapons and armor cost the equivalent of 30 silver in most cases. What massive needs is Inflation. More money in circulation to lower the value of each unit of currency, making the spending power of one regal significantly less. Its better for the seller, worse for the buyer. You can look it up, Wikipedia has some good information on the subject if you are curious to the truth behind my statements.
Getting further into my point, large money sinks already exist, with LWC and Faction Warzones. Factions themselves can also hold themselves responsible for getting money out of the hands of the players, if you really think thats what needs to be done, by taxing or charging money for certain services for their members.
What needs to happen, though, is more regals be introduced to the system, as well as a constantly updated standard of prices to go by for trading. Every item would be given value, and trade chat should be regulated by admins, to keep that value roughly around the same price, only changing when its good for the economy. More regals could be introduced with later quests, involving Massivemobs boss hunting, which could charge a fee to keep you from exploiting it very easy, different server events, higher mob-regal rewards, etc.
 
TheFinitePeach said:
What I think would be the best for the economy is to reduce the amount of regals in circulation and remove the amount of certain resources in circulation. Mostly diamonds.
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That wouldn't cause any change. By removing resources AND regals, they both retain equal value to one another.

I'm going to try for an analogy: Person A sells Apples. Person B sells Bread. Both want to have what the other person has.

Let us say that Person A has 20 apples and Person B has 5 loaves of Bread. That would cause the Bread to have more value than the Apples due to there being more Apples. Person B would, if they know what they're doing, sell Bread for at least 4 Apples. That is a 4:1 Exchange Ratio.

Now let us say that a big storm ruins the Apple Crop. Now Person A only has 10 Apples to trade. Person B still has 5 loaves of bread. Now though the Apples, due to being less common than in the first scenario, are worth more. Instead of each loaf of bread being sold for 4 apples they are sold for 2 apples each. This means that Apples, due to being rarer, have double their former value in relation to bread.

That is how Regals:Resources work - add Regals and they lose value in relation to other items. Remove Regals and they increase in value to other items - say, a stack of diamonds for 6 Regals. This is not an inherent problem so long as trade continues to occur, but it DOES have the effect of making it hard to pay rent at the Shop stalls as prices continue to drop. What needs to be done is for there to be a "Great Crusade!" by Regalia against the Qadir Sultanate that causes Regalia to purchase MASSIVE amounts of resources (wood, food, diamonds, stone, all of them) in order to fuel it. People sell their stuff to Regalian Shops and it vanishes from the server in a giant Resource Sink that makes diamonds less common while also increase the Regals in Circulation. Through that the value of items will begin to rise again.

@MonMarty - Great Crusade is a good idea, just sayin. -cough cough-
 
If you reduce regals and resources relative value does not change true. But if the only resource you remove is Diamonds and you remove Regals too. Then the value of Diamonds and Regals increases relative to everything else.
 
You forgot the following money sinks:

Factions
Regalian houses/shops
Lwc locks
 
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