A Indeterminate Future Of Massivecraft Lore

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It has recently been brought to my attention a large problem in massivecraft's lore. Recently(the past few months) we have had 1 race deleted and 1 subrace deleted and 1 subrace deemed practically unplayable. Due to having not as many people play these characters the staff deleted the thylan race and torrp subrace. Though, we didn't have dozens of players playing these races, we did have players with characters of these races. I was a proud owner of a thylan character and I heard several complaints of people's torrp characters being completely ruined. We should probably let go of these races because they will likely never return but this raises large concern: are the unpopular races being deleted? I prefer to play unpopular races and interbreeds because I like to be different(I don't know what's wrong with me). But I worry that the races I play are just going to be deleted one day. Candidates are: maiar, wulong, rashaq, etc. It is near impossible to change your character to a different race if the race is deleted due to the characteristics of a race being so determinate on character features and personalities(for another day). People put hard work into getting their characters approved and it is very difficult having to delete or practically ruin your character because the race it is is deleted. So are we just going to keep deleting unpopular races? We could possibly promote these races to players new and old but I don't think these complete redos and deletions are the answer. Please tell your opinions below. @Staff Roleplay
 
Unfortunately, most players don't want to play races considered 'ugly' or too different. These races get hyped up whenever they're introduced or rewritten, then seem to get forgotten and left unexplored by most players. Rewriting a race is an effective way of promoting a race because it draws attention to new features/altered features. How would you propose promoting a race? Do you have any solutions for the issue that you're addressing?
 
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Eledana said:
Unfortunately, most players don't want to play races considered 'ugly' or too different. These races get hyped up whenever they're introduced or rewritten, then seem to get forgotten and left unexplored by most players. Rewriting a race is an effective way of promoting a race because it draws attention to new features/removed features. How would you propose promoting a race? Do you have any solutions for the issue that you're addressing?
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There is not much that can be done, and frankly, that is a good thing. It would be weird if 30% of played characters were something other than human, wouldn't it? I mean, its a world ruled by ailor, built for ailor, and run by ailor. If all players mained as Maiar or Mekket, it would make no sense.

Cpt_Manta_Ray said:
Due to having not as many people play these characters the staff deleted the thylan race and torrp subrace.
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The problem with the Thylan is that so few people have played them ever, and so few have become important members of the RP community, where the Mekket have had a few important players And chances are, there will be some new form or Torrp sooner or later (I mean, the wiki page kinda gives us hints to that). Anyhow, the Thylan debate is over, no point in crying over it.
 
While i agree a litle:
you make it sound as if the world is going to end soon if we don't act quick.... why? Is it a porblem realy?
At best it's an inconvencience i'd say. there is this thing called "oversaturation". Somethimes things need to be cut down for other things to grow.
 
The races that are deleted are the way they are for a combination of three factors: They don't fit well into the lore, there isn't a large population to support rewriting, and lastly people don't play them correctly. The Vampires and I believe it was the Torrp? Anyway, they were/are being rewritten because players are not playing them correctly. If there is enough people playing them or a significant reason to rewrite them then the page is redone. If there aren't enough players and it isn't a vital piece of the lore to be a playable race then they are simply removed. Manpower is needed elsewhere instead on these mundane subjects. This is just my perspective from what I have witnessed/can recall/theorize.
 
Eledana said:
Unfortunately, most players don't want to play races considered 'ugly' or too different. These races get hyped up whenever they're introduced or rewritten, then seem to get forgotten and left unexplored by most players. Rewriting a race is an effective way of promoting a race because it draws attention to new features/altered features. How would you propose promoting a race? Do you have any solutions for the issue that you're addressing?
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we could possibly give out lore ideas for characters, I had absolutely amazing roleplay a deathling thylan because he hunted down ur throughout regalia and was always screaming and looking for ur. I feel as if we give people ideas for characters and stop telling all new players to create a ailor at first would probably help...
 
Alright. I'll make it simple. If no one cares or is ever interested in a race, or the number of interested players is 1 or 2, then it is not worth the man power to update or keep around. You're one of the only players that appears to be butthurt. That isn't worth the man power, in the long run.
 
Parz1vol said:
Alright. I'll make it simple. If no one cares or is ever interested in a race, or the number of interested players is 1 or 2, then it is not worth the man power to update or keep around. You're one of the only players that appears to be butthurt. That isn't worth the man power, in the long run.
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may I just ask, how much manpower is really needed? Like search "thylan qna" you won't find much. Its pretty much the same as making any other raced character on an app. I really don't feel that having unpopular races is to large detriment to the server. What I'm trying to point out here is that they can do this more and that nearly all unpopular races are at risk...
 
Wiki pages need to be updated with new lore and rewritten every so often to stay up with the new fun crap. Redesigns and rewrites can take weeks with 2 or 3 contributors from what I've seen when I work on races and stuff for my D&D games. It can take forever to settle on anything good. Manpower. Time. Too much. Only makes one complainer happy. No point.
 
To be fair, I see a ton of Rashaq, even if most are noobs playing them only for the cat-like features, and mAIAR ARE EVERYWHERE lmfao. I've seen quite a few wulong too. Even Tigran are rather popular in comparison to Thylan. Orcs? I've seen a lot of male orcs and only two females, for the previously mentioned reason: people don't like ugly or non-human-looking chars. The problem with certain races is, the staff would need to spent maybe even 3 weeks rewriting a race that three people play.
But that isn't the point. The Thylan debate is long since over. And yes, I agree that the lore has been receiving countless rewrites. But, a lot of the lore was inconsistent, misused, or underplayed, so by nature, it gets redone. I agree also that I'm afraid to play any chars with hidden magic, but that's because I know it'll be rewritten. You can avoid characters getting trashed by rewrites if you pay attention- I'm waiting on beast magic for my avanthar because I know it's being redone. In some cases, yes, change is unavoidable, such as with the Tigran or Vampire chars. But these changes are,, all-in-all, for the better of the server.
 
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hetalianpasta said:
To be fair, I see a ton of Rashaq, even if most are noobs playing them only for the cat-like features, and mAIAR ARE EVERYWHERE lmfao. I've seen quite a few wulong too. Even Tigran are rather popular in comparison to Thylan. Orcs? I've seen a lot of male orcs and only two females, for the previously mentioned reason: people don't like ugly or non-human-looking chars. The problem with certain races is, the staff would need to spent maybe even 3 weeks rewriting a race that three people play.
But that isn't the point. The Thylan debate is long since over. And yes, I agree that the lore has been receiving countless rewrites. But, a lot of the lore was inconsistent, misused, or underplayed, so by nature, it gets redone. I agree also that I'm afraid to play any chars with hidden magic, but that's because I know it'll be rewritten. You can avoid characters getting trashed by rewrites if you pay attention- I'm waiting on beast magic for my avanthar because I know it's being redone. In some cases, yes, change is unavoidable, such as with the Tigran or Vampire chars. But these changes are,, all-in-all, for the better of the server.
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My major concern is the life being deleted all together and ruining people's experiences and characters that they put hard work into
 
hetalianpasta said:
They can always just redo a char with a different race that's semi-similar.
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That's very difficult with how much a race is determinate of a character's traits and personalities now(again for another day). I heard accounts from people after the mekket rewrite that had incredible roleplay with torrp characters and they just abandoned them because there are MAJOR differences between torrp and circci. Torrp, as far as I know, were one of the two(the other being vissi) races that had no possible large intelligence or speaking common or that one mekket language that I forgot what's called. Going from a thylan to tigran/ur is very difficult when they have the motivation of killing ur because they were killed by an ur before they were a deathling. My opinion will be forever biased but seriously, I feel we should all fear that our characters will be deleted or completely ruined if we try to make a different character...
 
Cpt_Manta_Ray said:
Going from a thylan to tigran/ur is very difficult when they have the motivation of killing ur because they were killed by an ur before they were a deathling.
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May I ask, how many Ur characters have you actually ever killed? How many have you even interacted with? Traits based around races other than elfs and ailor never really... ever remain relevant.
 
I heavily doubt the staff are gonna delete every race that isn't Ailor. There certainly weren't many Circci, but they still got a rewrite. Honestly, how many Circci do you see on a daily basis? As long as there's the bare minimum amount of people playing the race, chances are it'll stay.

It's too bad about your Thylan character, and I would be upset too, but that doesn't add any credibility to your argument. We're talking about the server as a whole, not just one person who had fun playing as a Thylan. No matter how enjoyable it was, it doesn't change the fact that pretty much nobody had a Thylan character.

Also, how many Torrp players did you actually hear say that? I personally didn't hear much of an outcry when they were removed.
 
Cpt_Manta_Ray said:
That's very difficult with how much a race is determinate of a character's traits and personalities now(again for another day). I heard accounts from people after the mekket rewrite that had incredible roleplay with torrp characters and they just abandoned them because there are MAJOR differences between torrp and circci. Torrp, as far as I know, were one of the two(the other being vissi) races that had no possible large intelligence or speaking common or that one mekket language that I forgot what's called. Going from a thylan to tigran/ur is very difficult when they have the motivation of killing ur because they were killed by an ur before they were a deathling. My opinion will be forever biased but seriously, I feel we should all fear that our characters will be deleted or completely ruined if we try to make a different character...
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I /kind of/ agree, but honestly, no char is unsalvageable. I recently shelved and redid my old Te'suik vampire- the new lore didn't fit her character design and didn't seem as fitting for a high noble. I had to remove her vampirism and stuff, redid her backstory, to the point that she became a new char. But c'est la vie tbh. In my opinion her lore was a bit of a stretch anyways, and she's a lot more interesting now. So yes, I changed her race, name, age, talents, backstory, and bits of her personality to fit the change, but she's still playable and I sorta like her better now.
In general though, I've continued to play characters even despite changes. I was forced to switch one of my old favourite characters from a Dressolini Ailor to a Cielotharic Nelfin, and she stayed playable. It's hard with all the rewrites, yes, but sometimes you just need to roll with it. Hate to sound like /that person/, but staff work hard at what they do, and it's sorta unfair to say they have to redo a race no one plays anyways.
 
Cpt_Manta_Ray said:
Could you please elaborate?
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You made an argument about how it was a pain to change your thylan because he liked killing Ur. But be honest, have you ever even met an Ur as that character? I don't mean in the life story, I mean IG. My point is, traits like that are situational and often never really come into play, it's not that big a deal.
 
KirbyTheVampire said:
I heavily doubt the staff are gonna delete every race that isn't Ailor. There certainly weren't many Circci, but they still got a rewrite. Honestly, how many Circci do you see on a daily basis? As long as there's the bare minimum amount of people playing the race, chances are it'll stay.

It's too bad about your Thylan character, and I would be upset too, but that doesn't add any credibility to your argument. We're talking about the server as a whole, not just one person who had fun playing as a Thylan. No matter how enjoyable it was, it doesn't change the fact that pretty much nobody had a Thylan character.

Also, how many Torrp players did you actually hear say that? I personally didn't hear much of an outcry when they were removed.
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Ok you make a good argument here. It's just fear. People put some hard work into characters and to have them ruined because of unpopularity is just hard. It may be just me but I haveput a lot of hard work into a circci character that was completely ruined by the update- the day after approval. Meh I'm not going to complain. again its jjust fear
 
KiddingAround said:
You made an argument about how it was a pain to change your thylan because he liked killing Ur. But be honest, have you ever even met an Ur as that character? I don't mean in the life story, I mean IG. My point is, traits like that are situational and often never really come into play, it's not that big a deal.
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No but he searched every corner of the city and it was fun to hold a claw to every other persons throughout and ask if they saw one. it's not really a trait but more of a motive which is heavily dictated by race for animal-like characters
 
hetalianpasta said:
I /kind of/ agree, but honestly, no char is unsalvageable. I recently shelved and redid my old Te'suik vampire- the new lore didn't fit her character design and didn't seem as fitting for a high noble. I had to remove her vampirism and stuff, redid her backstory, to the point that she became a new char. But c'est la vie tbh. In my opinion her lore was a bit of a stretch anyways, and she's a lot more interesting now. So yes, I changed her race, name, age, talents, backstory, and bits of her personality to fit the change, but she's still playable and I sorta like her better now.
In general though, I've continued to play characters even despite changes. I was forced to switch one of my old favourite characters from a Dressolini Ailor to a Cielotharic Nelfin, and she stayed playable. It's hard with all the rewrites, yes, but sometimes you just need to roll with it. Hate to sound like /that person/, but staff work hard at what they do, and it's sorta unfair to say they have to redo a race no one plays anyways.
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The thing is that there are people who play these races and I don't think it's fair to delete the race altogether. I'm not saying that they have to rewrite theraces but deleting them takes parts away from the lore that is used. But then again, I could still.play a thylan as they are still in the lore but not listed as a playable race. ppeopl rp animals all the time
 
Cpt_Manta_Ray said:
The thing is that there are people who play these races and I don't think it's fair to delete the race altogether. I'm not saying that they have to rewrite theraces but deleting them takes parts away from the lore that is used. But then again, I could still.play a thylan as they are still in the lore but not listed as a playable race. ppeopl rp animals all the time
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The Thylan debate has long since ended. There's no need to keep talking about it, threads like these usually end up being locked anyways tbh.
 
Cpt_Manta_Ray said:
Ok you make a good argument here. It's just fear. People put some hard work into characters and to have them ruined because of unpopularity is just hard. It may be just me but I haveput a lot of hard work into a circci character that was completely ruined by the update- the day after approval. Meh I'm not going to complain. again its jjust fear
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I totally get that, but sometimes change is necessary for the greater good. Personally, I had zero interest in the Circci or the other Mekket subraces. Now, I could totally picture playing as one, though I probably won't for a good while, since I'm awaiting the new vampire lore so that I can begin thinking up ideas for a vampire character. In general, they seem a lot more accessible, which is a good thing, since people have more of an incentive to play as them.

In regards to races being deleted, it's often necessary if no one played that race, because lore does need to be updated. If it never got updated, the Dakkar would still be fire demon elemental thingies, and Maiar would still be water spirit...thingies, and there would be a whole swathe of lore inconsistencies. If said race is to be updated regularly, there needs to be people playing that race. Otherwise, other lore changes would take even longer.
 
Cpt_Manta_Ray said:
It has recently been brought to my attention a large problem in massivecraft's lore. Recently(the past few months) we have had 1 race deleted and 1 subrace deleted and 1 subrace deemed practically unplayable. Due to having not as many people play these characters the staff deleted the thylan race and torrp subrace. Though, we didn't have dozens of players playing these races, we did have players with characters of these races. I was a proud owner of a thylan character and I heard several complaints of people's torrp characters being completely ruined. We should probably let go of these races because they will likely never return but this raises large concern: are the unpopular races being deleted? I prefer to play unpopular races and interbreeds because I like to be different(I don't know what's wrong with me). But I worry that the races I play are just going to be deleted one day. Candidates are: maiar, wulong, rashaq, etc. It is near impossible to change your character to a different race if the race is deleted due to the characteristics of a race being so determinate on character features and personalities(for another day). People put hard work into getting their characters approved and it is very difficult having to delete or practically ruin your character because the race it is is deleted. So are we just going to keep deleting unpopular races? We could possibly promote these races to players new and old but I don't think these complete redos and deletions are the answer. Please tell your opinions below. @Staff Roleplay
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Quite frankly,I do agree that it's sort of a downer to have a race that you play omitted,but you can't say that there aren't a fair share of races that need a good update,or rewrite like the Tigrans,who I would personally play if not for the obviously impending rewrite.I've brought up the Tigran thing before and people don't seem to have a reason for hating them other than "they suck".I'm certain that opinions may differ, but for the most part all of the daragon except the ur seem to be neglected.Come to think of it,the ur might become the only race under the classification if someone decides the torgans are just clutter.boy that rant sure was satisfying
 
KirbyTheVampire said:
In regards to races being deleted, it's often necessary if no one played that race, because lore does need to be updated. If it never got updated, the Dakkar would still be fire demon elemental thingies, and Maiar would still be water spirit...thingies, and there would be a whole swathe of lore inconsistencies. If said race is to be updated regularly, there needs to be people playing that race. Otherwise, other lore changes would take even longer.
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Still, deletion? It's just that their are people that play these races...
 
Cpt_Manta_Ray said:
Still, deletion? It's just that their are people that play these races...
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I'm pretty sure one of the staff members said that there was only one or two approved Thylans before they were made unplayable. I'm not sure about the Torrp, but I'm sure the number of approved Torrp characters could easily be counted on one hand, and I doubt there has ever been a Torrp character that actually contributed anything major to the roleplay community and wasn't just a simple background character. I'd hardly say they're very popular races. Besides, the Thylan were simply made unplayable, not removed from the lore. Maybe eventually when there's not so much lore that needs to be written, like the Dakkar, Chien-ji, various magic types that need a rewrite or haven't been written at all yet, vampirism etc etc, they might get a re-write. At this point in time, there's a lot more important lore that needs to be written, so the Thylan have been shelved for now.
 
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I do agree it sucks, but on the same note. The race still exists in lore. Just because it is unplayable at the moment because staff do not have time to rewrite it doesn't mean it wont ever make a comeback. If there is demand in the future, and lore staff have time, Thylans might end up coming back in eventually.
 
again, technically, they are feasibly playable, they still exist in the lore, and people have roleplayed as animals and such before...
KirbyTheVampire said:
I'm pretty sure one of the staff members said that there was only one approved Thylan before they were made unplayable. I'm not sure about the Torrp, but I'm sure the number of approved Torrp characters could easily be counted on one hand, and I doubt there has ever been a Torrp character that actually contributed anything major to the roleplay community and wasn't just a simple background character. I'd hardly say they're very popular races. Besides, the Thylan were simply made unplayable, not removed from the lore. Maybe eventually when there's not so much lore that needs to be written, like the Dakkar, Chien-ji, various magic types that need a rewrite or haven't been written at all yet, vampirism etc etc, they might get a re-write. At this point in time, there's a lot more important lore that needs to be written, so the Thylan have been shelved for now.
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hetalianpasta said:
Y'all do realize this thread will probably be locked if you continue on the Thylan train? The Thylan debate is over, no need to keep discussing it tbh.
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this is about something bigger than the thylan debate but still, its only a matter of time before the thread is locked, and its only a matter of time before I'm muted/banned completely...
 
Cpt_Manta_Ray said:
this is about something bigger than the thylan debate but still, its only a matter of time before the thread is locked, and its only a matter of time before I'm muted/banned completely...
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Why exactly would you be banned?
And, this is honestly bordering turning into a flame war imo. I think everyone needs to cool it down a bit. Then again, most threads like this typically do.
 
hetalianpasta said:
Why exactly would you be banned?
And, this is honestly bordering turning into a flame war imo. I think everyone needs to cool it down a bit. Then again, most threads like this typically do.
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I've been trying to keep this in a debate format, it's all about how interpret the wording. Excuse me if any of this content has come off aggressive or rude and I understand that my viewpoint is biased as I have been affected by the change more than once. again, I am not trying to come off rude or aggressive. and for the reason I would get muted or banned- I'm just that type of person...
 

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