- Joined
- Jun 29, 2012
- Messages
- 4,429
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- Age
- 33
Introduction
Noble Revisions, they are as old as Massive is, and for good reason. Any system needs to be shaken up every so often to stave off complacency and boredom. For nobility this is doubly true, because in the past we have invested a lot of effort to ensure the trickle down roleplay working for the community as an additional crutch for activity. The conflicts of nobility, and the social ladders they present, were always a good means for players to get ahead. Following my takeover of MassiveCraft last year, the system was put on serious ice. Most of the executive forces were given to the players instead of the Noble Managers in fear of overbearing paperwork. As time went by however, the need for paperwork became less, and time held for reflections increased.
Nobility has always suffered a huge problem: How to make everyone stop being cowards. Inherently, everyone in nobility /wants/ to play the game of politics, but everyone is /too afraid/ to do so, because of the uncertainty of negative consequences. Whether it be at the hands of a massive alliance, an OOC deadlock, or simple inaction, Noble conflict was like playing Russian roulette with 1 of the 6 chambers empty, with your hands tied behind your back, and having the trigger pulled by someone else. Numerous attempts were made to shore up this problem by forcing conflict, for example with the Great 3 of Drixagh, the tension between Howlester and Zastorzy, the Harhold-Veer crisis, and more. Ultimately however, they always resulted in the exact same response: Nobles mobilizing their troops and fortifying their lands, and then staring at each other from a cross a really tall fence, and hurling Forum insults at each other without any action.
It caused these weird fluctuations where something would happen, the nobles would rush to plot, days of activity was given, and then nothing. When things got pressing, the nobles either switched to criminal alt characters, submitted in defeat or passiveness, or flat out left the server because the dread of losing imaginary reputation became too much to bear. After more considerations, I believe I've finally found a major crux in Nobility that caused the situation to be what it is today.
The Issue of Nobility
The Issue of Nobility can actually easily be identified by comparing it to say, the game Crusader Kings 2. Here, you (usually, unless you're a doorknob) start as a Count of XYZ province somewhere. Through conquest and marriage you can quickly expand, but rarely if ever do main terrain segments stay in-tact. For example, I as count of Holland once inherited the Kingdom of Navarra, which I made my main title. My Holland County was eventually lost in a succession crisis to one of my brothers, and so in the time span of a few decades, my characters had switched from Dutch lowlanders, to Pyrenees Navarre. While this is perhaps not as fluidly possible in nobility (because most of our characters are self-inserts) it brings up the comparable problem: Identity extension. In Crusader Kings 2, specific land plots are a means to an end. They are a stepping tone to greatness, prestige, piety, a Kingdom, and Empire, and more. In MassiveCraft Nobility, the titles are the achievement in itself. I believe that the player base does not see the land and title as a tool to engage with, but an extension to themselves.
Noble Families are all dressed in the same clothing representing their house's colors, and all have the same physical traits as if they are terrible inbred, but somehow aren't according to their family tree (I know this is ironic of me to say since I was the one who popularized wearing your family's colors years ago, but to my defense, I also tried to get rid of it in vain). Family lands are the /perfect/ match for their rulers, complimenting their aesthetic or their personality in an absolutely perfect way. It's almost like the players in nobility treat their lands as a non-living but ever present extension of their character or a representation of their character. Like the one cannot live without the other, and this is the crux of this problem, the over self-identification with lands held by characters, leading to extreme aversion to even the idea of losing anything. If a loss was imparted, it would feel like a piece of the character was destroyed, which in turn feels like an attack on the person behind the screen. Not just "another stepping stone" like it would be in CK2.
Is this an unreasonable case to have, are the noble players somehow at fault? No, not for the most part. The mentality has come over time, both by stories of loss that were done in the past and unclear regulations on continuation. The Noble managers put too much stress on performance in the system with what was given, and did not give enough afterthought. It would seem however, that at a first glance, most issues stem from this central problem. The nobles become lethargic and complacent because the status quo suits them. Anything unexpected, anything chaotic, might result in a loss of eminence, which in itself feels like a loss of a part of a character. Loss is such a dreaded concept, that it is paralyzing. But in identifying this concept, there are obvious pathways to fix it. I should say in advance, not every noble functions the same way. We've always maintained that nobility should function a certain way, and have tried pushing in that direction, but never to the fullest of commitment. As such, I clarify, that these changes are going to happen, regardless of how many people it upsets, regardless of how many people turn away from nobility, and regardless of how many tongues waggle with doomsday predictions. Nobility should function a certain way, and we suspect not every family is capable of functioning in how we always envisioned nobility should function. This means that if we lose a third or even half the noble families, this is an acceptable collateral damage, for the sake of the remaining population. Half an active population, is still better than a full inactive population.
What does this mean
Noble Revisions, they are as old as Massive is, and for good reason. Any system needs to be shaken up every so often to stave off complacency and boredom. For nobility this is doubly true, because in the past we have invested a lot of effort to ensure the trickle down roleplay working for the community as an additional crutch for activity. The conflicts of nobility, and the social ladders they present, were always a good means for players to get ahead. Following my takeover of MassiveCraft last year, the system was put on serious ice. Most of the executive forces were given to the players instead of the Noble Managers in fear of overbearing paperwork. As time went by however, the need for paperwork became less, and time held for reflections increased.
Nobility has always suffered a huge problem: How to make everyone stop being cowards. Inherently, everyone in nobility /wants/ to play the game of politics, but everyone is /too afraid/ to do so, because of the uncertainty of negative consequences. Whether it be at the hands of a massive alliance, an OOC deadlock, or simple inaction, Noble conflict was like playing Russian roulette with 1 of the 6 chambers empty, with your hands tied behind your back, and having the trigger pulled by someone else. Numerous attempts were made to shore up this problem by forcing conflict, for example with the Great 3 of Drixagh, the tension between Howlester and Zastorzy, the Harhold-Veer crisis, and more. Ultimately however, they always resulted in the exact same response: Nobles mobilizing their troops and fortifying their lands, and then staring at each other from a cross a really tall fence, and hurling Forum insults at each other without any action.
It caused these weird fluctuations where something would happen, the nobles would rush to plot, days of activity was given, and then nothing. When things got pressing, the nobles either switched to criminal alt characters, submitted in defeat or passiveness, or flat out left the server because the dread of losing imaginary reputation became too much to bear. After more considerations, I believe I've finally found a major crux in Nobility that caused the situation to be what it is today.
The Issue of Nobility
The Issue of Nobility can actually easily be identified by comparing it to say, the game Crusader Kings 2. Here, you (usually, unless you're a doorknob) start as a Count of XYZ province somewhere. Through conquest and marriage you can quickly expand, but rarely if ever do main terrain segments stay in-tact. For example, I as count of Holland once inherited the Kingdom of Navarra, which I made my main title. My Holland County was eventually lost in a succession crisis to one of my brothers, and so in the time span of a few decades, my characters had switched from Dutch lowlanders, to Pyrenees Navarre. While this is perhaps not as fluidly possible in nobility (because most of our characters are self-inserts) it brings up the comparable problem: Identity extension. In Crusader Kings 2, specific land plots are a means to an end. They are a stepping tone to greatness, prestige, piety, a Kingdom, and Empire, and more. In MassiveCraft Nobility, the titles are the achievement in itself. I believe that the player base does not see the land and title as a tool to engage with, but an extension to themselves.
Noble Families are all dressed in the same clothing representing their house's colors, and all have the same physical traits as if they are terrible inbred, but somehow aren't according to their family tree (I know this is ironic of me to say since I was the one who popularized wearing your family's colors years ago, but to my defense, I also tried to get rid of it in vain). Family lands are the /perfect/ match for their rulers, complimenting their aesthetic or their personality in an absolutely perfect way. It's almost like the players in nobility treat their lands as a non-living but ever present extension of their character or a representation of their character. Like the one cannot live without the other, and this is the crux of this problem, the over self-identification with lands held by characters, leading to extreme aversion to even the idea of losing anything. If a loss was imparted, it would feel like a piece of the character was destroyed, which in turn feels like an attack on the person behind the screen. Not just "another stepping stone" like it would be in CK2.
Is this an unreasonable case to have, are the noble players somehow at fault? No, not for the most part. The mentality has come over time, both by stories of loss that were done in the past and unclear regulations on continuation. The Noble managers put too much stress on performance in the system with what was given, and did not give enough afterthought. It would seem however, that at a first glance, most issues stem from this central problem. The nobles become lethargic and complacent because the status quo suits them. Anything unexpected, anything chaotic, might result in a loss of eminence, which in itself feels like a loss of a part of a character. Loss is such a dreaded concept, that it is paralyzing. But in identifying this concept, there are obvious pathways to fix it. I should say in advance, not every noble functions the same way. We've always maintained that nobility should function a certain way, and have tried pushing in that direction, but never to the fullest of commitment. As such, I clarify, that these changes are going to happen, regardless of how many people it upsets, regardless of how many people turn away from nobility, and regardless of how many tongues waggle with doomsday predictions. Nobility should function a certain way, and we suspect not every family is capable of functioning in how we always envisioned nobility should function. This means that if we lose a third or even half the noble families, this is an acceptable collateral damage, for the sake of the remaining population. Half an active population, is still better than a full inactive population.
What does this mean
- The Application system remains the same. We're very happy with how the application system works right now, and we're also pleased with the success rate of new families. We're hit a nice good spot with the recruitment mechanic so that remains unchanged.
- The War System will remain with the Casus Belli creation idea. There will be no hard numbers, no math, no game plan based on stacking numbers together for instant-victory. Nobility voted for the lack of numbers in the last poll, but I am personally also of the opinion that allowing hard numbers to exist gives Nobles the means to deadlock their own game play. If everything is an unknown and an unexpected disappointment or surprise, then no outcome is ever guaranteed and everyone can rest assured that there is a chance of winning anything. How this system works will soon be announced along with the Imperial Court Favor announcements.
- NPC Families are being scrubbed from the System, bar some really important factors like the Anahera Cabal, the Vultarin Hegemony and the Calemberg Arch duchy. It is impossible for us to simulate 30+ noble families and have them organically respond to the politics of the PC families without going through a 3 A3 checklist each time someone so much as farts in the direction of another noble house. Some of those important NPC's remain because of story relevance, and maintain their own agenda, but they will not actively seek expansion at the expense of players, unless the players challenge them or get them on board with their own plans.
- Empty lands will be filled with spheres of influence, meaning each Noble Family will receive more land, but some empty spots will remain for the sake of Court Intrigue. What this means is that if a conflict should break out between let's say house Sorenvik and Yaotl, that peripheral lands away from the core region (where the sea of power/capital is) will be fought over, before the heartland. This cushions the immediate peril of warfare. It's like playing with glass beads given by your friends which are all kind of second hand, but leaving grandpa's special glass bead for last. Ducal families will be compensated with a bigger sphere than counts, who are bigger than barons, etc. In terms of manpower and income however, these are utterly irrelevant. Income and manpower will always be dictated by how well the lords can convince their subjects to support their cause. If a Duke is a tyrant, he may find less soldiers fight for him than the beleaguered baron, or at least fight with less defensive vigor.
- Wars will last longer. In the past, wars (for example between Peirgarten and du Pont) were over in a few days. A single battle decided the fate of the Peirgarten lands instantly, and the occupation experienced no resistance. In real life, occupation resistance as well as longer sieges were far more prevalent, even rebellions in relatively stable lands for a variety of reasons. Wars will be protracted by requiring the siege of numerous strongholds on each noble lands, which each take time turn in turn. This allows for more flexible sides on wars that aren't decided in a matter of hours, or before they are even started.
- All titles can be lost, indefinitely, but not permanently. What this means is that if a Noble loses control over all land they own, they will (like in the terms of Paradox Games) at 100% war score instant surrender. This means that they have to accept any terms placed on them by the victor of the war, even if this means they lose all their lands. This is however not the end of nobility because titles will become floating. For example, if the Duke of the Southlands has all their lands conquered by House du Pont, they become "Duke at Court". They retain their title and can still operate in nobility from the capital, still owning wealth stored in banks, and their estates in the capital city. The benefit here is that loss is never final. There are a number of wars a noble family can get their land back, or operate without land indefinitely, or get an entirely new strip of land assigned. More info on this later.
- The Assembly is being ctrl+alt+deleted. The Assembly is really tough, it's a 20 man voting squad where most voters don't care, or have a vested interest in simply doing nothing. Instead, we're moving to the Emperor's Royal Cabinet (consisting of Dukes and Counts), an entirely new system where a small select group of speakers may address the Emperor during weekly Audiences. When addressing the Emperor, someone may propose a piece of legislation and defend their case directly to the Emperor. Convincing one voter is always easier than 20 voters, especially when that one voter (me) has a vested interest in seeing things change and develop. Furthermore, those wishing to argue against a proposal can elect another speaker from their midst to debate in front of the Emperor, who will act as mediator. To allow more width, a few families who are hopefuls will be upgraded to Count Families (as Barons are barred from speaking to the Emperor directly). The families facing promotion are: de Letoirneau, von Rahm, Delmotte, Carwell, Rote and du Pont. This decision was made by a combination of 1. assuming competency 2. history of "stirring shit" and 3. likelihood of their promotion causing more drama. More details on the Assembly will be posted soon, and how non-Nobles can get involved. No more dragging long debates, no more voting deadlocks. Just a single person to convince, and more activity to get there.
- The Imperial Court is still underway, but also with part of the Honneurs system intact. Imagine court politics like a bar of -5, 0, and +5. Everyone is at 0, and if someone can make a habit of embarrassing or humiliating other noble families to the court, they become -5, or intimidating. Inversely, if other noble families sing the praises of a particular family they become +5, or favored by the court. Either side, either tactic, can result in title grants and additional bonuses. Additional titles within the court will come into being, reminiscing the old flavor titles but also function titles. A thread will be dedicated to the Imperial Court soon.
- Military positions are back as well. We're looking into military cabinet meetings and returning the old principle of the Mark generals who get assigned to war marks for foreign conflicts. More details on this later.
- House Kade and House Howlester remain in their shared DM position as the "Safety Button" of nobility in case things go south, in case players start abusing each other for the sake of it, or in case something starts sliding sideways out of the realm of lore viability. These houses will not expand, ever, period. House Kade will not get involved in any military conduct, while Howlester might send smaller volunteer forces, but will principally also not involve themselves with the dealings of the lower nobles unless they attempt to challenge Howlester Authority over their respective territories and offices.
- In game progressions for relevancy. Major battles in the field or sieges should remain on forum progressions, but we're looking into allowing small strike teams to for example assassinate a captain, burn a supply cache, kill a messenger, kidnap an NPC relative, small actions that can have major concerquences between the nobility. In the past we could never really settle to move some activity in-Game which resulted in a feeling of noble progressions being very distant. Now, we might be able to finally make those activities very relevant to everyone by creating special teams achieving major milestones in a conflict.
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