Server Population

Should the server invest in some ads to kick up the server's population number?

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Firetailmadness

Firetailmadness

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Okay, so Im new here, and I'm not really sure what really works for people on this server or not, but does no one think that the server, especially the faction worlds is usually dead after 6 (US time) or so?

It really kills the mood and it makes things kinda boring, most factions are now small with 1-4 people logging in total in a day, nothing gets done and no one seems to be enjoying it, and so I do have to ask this: Is the server being advertised? from the good amount of money the server makes does no one ever think that perhaps advertising it would be a good idea to curb the server from going quiet after 6 or so?

I'd love to stay up all night and chat and build and do cool and fun stuff with faction members and what not, and I totally would stay up for it, but its hard when they're all asleep because consequently the faction will slowly go offline one by one, if there is anyone online that is, this whole thread is a garbled mess and not very thought through so forgive me, just venting my frustration I suppose.

If I'm missing something here or maybe I overlooked something tell me about it.
 
not truly pertinent to the discussion, but i think factions late at night chatting and hanging out was probably one of my better memories from my early teens
 
Same feeling here just got back after 5 years of absence and it make me sad to see massive with such low pop. :/
 
An issue I see is new player support. The main hub, while nicely built, is just filled with signs upon signs I wouldn't read. One of the reasons stayed was because of player like @DrFong who engage players immediately after joining, and those crucial first few minutes are what make or break Massive.

Massive isn't as popular as before due to many reasons, but looking at the stats on the main page, we get a good number of new players each day. They just don't return. So I think the best way to allocate resources is on new player retention. The old guard can adapt, but without new players staying, the population stays the same and eventually decays.
 
FireFan96 said:
So I think the best way to allocate resources is on new player retention.
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Yump! They say it costs 10x the resources to gain a new customer than it does to retain an existing one.

Stick me up front near spawn and I'll go back to my tradition of greeting new players. Without space near spawn I have no reason to be standing there greeting new players. Put me in coach. I'm ready to play.
 
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Genuinely have had to personally help newbies around myself who either never made to the tutorials or weren't interested enough to look for one. They often just wander around Regalia, looking to get started on survival but find the strange and confusing role play world instead. Perhaps it would be simpler to push newbies into a survival based hub, make it easier for them to get out of the initial spawn villages (maybe a tp sign to the village edge?) and just let them go.

Also heard a story from a guy who didn't know about the massiverestore resets and was thoroughly miffed when his unclaimed home was cut in two, perhaps an emphasis on the more unique aspects of massive should be made before we through people into it.
 
Mojaven said:
I'd love to bring in new players but that brings in toxic players as well lol.
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Everything we do will bring in toxicity. In real life as well as in game. It's a trade that's worthwhile making. Toxicity can be dealt with, new players cannot be formed from mid-air. The community has dealt with toxicity before, it still does and will continue to do so.
 
Firetailmadness said:
Is the server being advertised? from the good amount of money the server makes does no one ever think that perhaps advertising it would be a good idea to curb the server from going quiet after 6 or so?

If I'm missing something here or maybe I overlooked something tell me about it.
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The server is frequently updated through various social media sites. We also do outreach to streamers and RP communities to come check out our server. Obviously, the player base internally doesn't see it cause....it's external!

TheyCalledMeKiko said:
Genuinely have had to personally help newbies around myself who either never made to the tutorials or weren't interested enough to look for one.
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Most of the things that follow actually should look at the above quote. PR can bring new people in all day. We can try to have events, make things clear. @DrFong as PR staff, is totally within his realm to help newbies get started. But ultimately, the player retention comes from the folks who commented on this thread, and play every day. PR staff doesn't make a community. We celebrate our community. The whole reason I've remained PR staff is, quite simply, the players who log on every day. Those people who love MassiveCraft, and who love it enough to help build what we have. But it's really up to the player base to decide what kind of server they want. Do they want to engage new players? Then go for it! Do they want to voice their opinions in a productive way? Go for it! It's not going to be me, or another staff member that is the sole reason we have player retention. It's up to the community at large to welcome and engage players.

That being said, we're always on the lookout for ways to help new players, and existing community members, get more out of MassiveCraft. So if anyone ever has an idea they want to share, my inbox is open!

Thank you all for continuing to play here, and continuing to make MassiveCraft everyone's home away from home.
 
a nice short and unique starter quest showing the ropes of faction and *cough* monologue time *cough* would bring lots of players. some factions used to help out alot with the beginning like asteria and other factions but these days no one is active
 
Mojaven said:
I'd love to bring in new players but that brings in toxic players as well lol.
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Well, Mojaven, here's why we won't HAVE toxic players.
Most of the toxic Factions players are there solely for the raid and the PvP. PVP isn't a giant thing on Massivecraft, and TNT is disabled, so raiding is null. They can't build their big unraidable bases, and all those things combined will make the PTW-Factions players quit. We will have a much higher retention rate of builders and roleplayers than raiders and pvpers, because the raiders and pvpers will often quit once they see their community isn't prevalent.
 
DominicMorgen said:
Well, Mojaven, here's why we won't HAVE toxic players.
Most of the toxic Factions players are there solely for the raid and the PvP. PVP isn't a giant thing on Massivecraft, and TNT is disabled, so raiding is null. They can't build their big unraidable bases, and all those things combined will make the PTW-Factions players quit. We will have a much higher retention rate of builders and roleplayers than raiders and pvpers, because the raiders and pvpers will often quit once they see their community isn't prevalent.
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i mean there is a difference between toxicity and pvpers/factions isnt all the toxic comes from
 
DominicMorgen said:
But let's face it, most of the toxicity comes from factions players. Statistically speaking, competetive players are more likely to be toxic. I myself have met very few groups of intolerant roleplayers.
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At least based on my experiences, where factions players are belittled incessantly by roleplayers for having the inferior play style, can you really blame them for the toxicity?
 
DominicMorgen said:
Well, Mojaven, here's why we won't HAVE toxic players.
Most of the toxic Factions players are there solely for the raid and the PvP. PVP isn't a giant thing on Massivecraft, and TNT is disabled, so raiding is null. They can't build their big unraidable bases, and all those things combined will make the PTW-Factions players quit. We will have a much higher retention rate of builders and roleplayers than raiders and pvpers, because the raiders and pvpers will often quit once they see their community isn't prevalent.
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Which is objectively a problem for the server. When PvP dies, Factions dies. When Factions dies, guess what happens to the server funds?
 
Even the toxicity between pvpers isn't as bad as all roleplayers make it out to be, a lot of the time it's just banter. Some people may take it too far sometimes.
Maybe what we need is a spurt of new factions to reinvigorate the community, having leaders who aren't just interested in getting recruits for a build they've just bought (which returning to the server I experienced immediately).
I honestly believe because we've been sat stagnant for so long that no one cares enough to recruit anymore, recruit chat used to be brimming with adverts constantly, I used to PM people in wilderness ffs when I used to recruit for Arakdan.
The trick is to make people feel valued. In the aforementioned faction I was recruited into initially I found two of the other players in said faction just running around with nothing to do, speaking to them I found out they had joined hoping for a job etc and simply never been given one, or even a home to call their own. I think we treat our newbs like dirt that gives us power, in comparison to what we used to, as valuable resource collectors, farmers and body fodder, and it's a shame.
 
DominicMorgen said:
Not necessarily. I feel like if PvP dies completely, Factions may become more of a roleplay thing.
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I don't think that's ever happened when PvP hit its various stages of inactivity, at least in my history of the server. Factions was most active when PvP was most active- that much is indisputable. When you saw factions like Grimsbane, Magnanimus, Raptum, etc. is when people were actively flocking to our server for its Factions experience. And in my opinion, that's when the server was its most enjoyable point, where I'd be on literally every day for 10 hours during the holidays because premium features were available for everyone and there were fights everywhere, all the time. When our scrub faction Vandelnar would raid Grimsbane, with the faintest hope of winning and getting maybe one god weapon out of it. Or, when Wannag complained 24/7 in teamspeak because he ran out of armour and his /fix was depleted. And I can't even imagine what it was like for the even older players, who had 20 man raids on factions like Alamut way back in the day.

Nowadays... things are different. People aren't excited to play Factions anymore, the magic is gone for everything from exploring Magnanimus' castle, or Darkrooming, or even just looking out over a mountain (God I miss Ellador). And frankly, that worries me, and it's actively ruining Factions for a lot of people, hence why PvP has hit a slump and notable Factions simply refuse to PvP. It's not good when PvP dies, and no one should think it is.

Massive always bounces back though, and this time I think we have a real shot at getting pvp back to what it was in the "good old days." We have a large and dedicated Game team, and new players joining the server daily. Hopefully, the only way from here is up.
 
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So I am going to do my best to provide solutions rather than restate the problem. These solutions can be inputted now with hopefully no discussion from me about WHAT exactly. I am going to lay out a problem and fixes for it.

Problem: Player retention. We have new players come in all the time. I have seen it first hand myself on multiple accounts. The issue is they do not stay and I am going to highlight why.

Confusion: The tutorial at the moment is... well let's just say lacking. Especially for the RP environment. When players log in there is of course the basic tutorial but even that is... lacking.

Solution for confusion: I would love to have @DrFong sit there all day and greet players and teach them and I'm sure he would as well. But that's not going to work for EVERY player. So of course this information has to be automated. My solution is redo the tutorial. Make it simple. The best way to do this would be by using quest. Set up some npcs, like two, that shortly explain factions and RP hopefully in a fun way. The most important part of this however, is it gives lots of information in very few words. We can do this with the power of links. For instance, links to the wiki for RP, character sheets, etc. All the extended things you would need. But players don't like links. So on top of that, there would need to be a few sentence "this is what it is and this is how you do it". With both of these changes, the players should be a lot less confused.

Out of things to do: Ok so now our players know what they are doing but they can't just jump in and start messing about. They can go one of two ways (usually): factions or RP. It's hard to start either of these without getting lucky and meeting people.

Solution: The power of muting chats. For the first hour or so, the only chats players should see is help chat, recruitment chat, and rp chat. This is by default but they will be messaged on how to turn chats on immediately. But them choosing to turn the chat on makes a huge difference. This way they can ask for help, and get plenty of recruitment messages at the same time. All we need is for them to click with someone. And it has to be fast. They will not stay unless they have something to work towards or do. Having all the other chats going with random garbage makes players feel ignored. We have all been there.

Summing it all up, we get players all the time. But they are confused and don't know how to start. I think fixing the beginning is a sure way to have them stay till the end.
 
aprader1 said:
the only chats players should see is help chat, recruitment chat, and rp chat.
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I would replace rp chat with general chat. purely because rp chat caters to one side of the server, and a new player may be going for factions, and seeing a rp chat will make them assume rp is the main thing (which while on player population it is, factions has benefits as well)
 
FireFan96 said:
I would replace rp chat with general chat. purely because rp chat caters to one side of the server, and a new player may be going for factions, and seeing a rp chat will make them assume rp is the main thing (which while on player population it is, factions has benefits as well)
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Thats the same thing with recruitment chat. I was providing one of each side.
 
I remember when I started massive you were brought into a spawn that explained all you needed to know from factions to rp and if memory serves me there was a floating hub that held portals not only for regalia but also the faction worlds, this offered an immediate choice and didn't leave you confused or lost! Personally I think it is time to get back to basics, constantly rebuilding of the server looks great on paper, but when there is nothing tangible to show on paper eg increased player numbers then it is a waste of time. Personally as a factions player I respect role players but I believe it is time to place regalia on the back burner for now, regalia is built up, looks good and can stand on its own two feet, perhaps let's look towards the other half of the server, the half that yes can be "toxic" but the half that gave this server its name and boost!
 
I personally think the answer is simple... Minecraft is dying. When people say "it's not as popular as it was before" that's what they really mean. Ever since Microsoft bought it MC has been steadily losing players. Nothing really changes anymore. There aren't any awesome new advances. My favorite time was when the game was getting regular updates and things were kept fresh. Plus the game is getting up there in age. Honestly, it's amazing we've made it this far! I started playing Minecraft in 2010! I can't think of many games I still play on a regular basis that are that old.
 
When I joined, I never imagined I would have gotten into roleplay. In fact, when I joined, I was very hostile towards even the idea of it. I had no idea that the server had anything of the sort. I was spawned into a hub room, where I saw four portals, and I went into what was familiar to me, which was a portal to the factions worlds in which I joined a faction that I found constructing a base high up in the snowy mountains of Ellador-- what was different with this faction, was that it the leader was not only interested in grabbing players for claim power, or building some huge city for no real reason, but instead having fun and forming a small community. It was no mega-faction, and it never would be, we all knew this. But what made me log on everyday, and continue playing, was not roleplay or PvP, but the welcoming and NOT overly unfriendly community that I knew at the time. I was at the time, a factioner that was more in the idea of playing Minecraft with a group of people, rather than PvP or building. Eventually I left the faction, and joined Docktown, which, while it had a massively over sized build, was manned with a close-knit community full of wonderful people like AaronChewey, TheNetherSquid, Pixel147 (I think), and @Mecharic. It was very friendly to both newbies and non-newbies. Instead of sucking up players, we engaged them helped them and did not seeming overly-enforcing of Massive's way of life.

Currently, I believe that while the fact factions can seem fairly hostile towards beginners due to how the community can seem at first glance, I don't believe this is the issue. The issue, in my mind and my experience, is instead the way we introduce our new players to the server. I for one, would not have stayed for long if I logged onto the server and saw signs (Which I would have have walked past) and was immediately teleported into the roleplay world, with local chat as my first form of chat communication. I was very lucky that Cayorion was standing just across the street, getting the sitting plugin working again. He spoke to me, and told me how to get into general chat. In a way, he was my form of DrFong for you newer players. While i'm not factioner anymore, that doesn't make my opinion any less valid. We've ought to have our initial spawn something more engaging than what it is nowadays, and teach people how the server works through something other than a massive wall of signs. I understand the quest plugin in its current state isn't good for new players, and so a different approach may be something to look at. The old premium information hub for example, could be something to look at for inspiration on how to attract these new players once again, as well as helping them into a survival world to get their feet on the ground.

I for one, will be interacting with Massive for as long as it exists.
 
PVP is a big thing in the server. It's the biggest thing in factions. Embrace it, and shift focus on nurturing this pvp experience so it becomes very enjoyable for the people who choose to pvp.
And for those who don't want to pvp in factions, they shouldn't be forced to, and should be left to do what it is they want to do instead.

The best times when it came to activity was when big fights happened. When big fights happen, people are motivated to build up their cities and bases, produce gear and other materials, recruit more people, and overall be more active. When big fights happen, it creates hype and enthusiasm in the factions world. To the benefit of every faction, even of those who don't partake in the fighting.

It feels like the leadership of the server doesn't realize how central pvp is to the entire factions experience. How it creates buzz, how it creates fun competition, how it makes people active and driven to improve and outcompete. It is the main drive of the biggest factions that are worth their salt, a drive that gets them to build some sort of economy; build beautiful buildings; recruit more people into their communities who aren't necessarily pvpers; perhaps even to write lore. And as they are active, other factions that do not fight benefit too, as the overall enthusiasm of the factions world is high and as more people are active, more people join. People flock to activity.

This is the process that made factions successful and active in the last few years. And it was a success for both fighting factions and peaceful factions.
 
@SpunSugar @DrFong how well do you think something like Player Moderators, or Helpers, would go over? Those are just names some games give them, Helper is probably more fitting. Essentially just a player role for people who actively hang out in spawns and guide new players, drawn from RP and Survival both. No perms, just a shiny name and a small region in the hub they can open doors in maybe.

Theres another thread about redesigning the hub, adding a lounge area in the entry of it or close to there where Helpers could hang out and guide new players along might help people stick around.
 

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