Redefining Factions

TMI_Lord_Khan

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DISCLAIMER: These are the ramblings of a relatively new, generally inexperienced player. Please feel free to correct me on any facts that I get wrong. :DISCLAIMER

For a long time now, the rift between PVP and RP has been growing. Notice that I say PVP and RP. Nowhere does factions fit in. Factions for a long time now, at least in my opinion, has been seen as generally synonymous with PVP and separate from RP. Here's the google definition of Faction.

fac·tion
[ˈfakSH(ə)n]
NOUN
factions (plural noun)
  1. a small, organized, dissenting group within a larger one, especially in politics:
    "the left-wing faction of the party"
clique · coterie · caucus · cabal · bloc · camp · group · grouping · sector · section · wing · arm · branch · set · ginger group · pressure group

While this definition of factions doesn't exactly apply to minecraft factions, note "group" and note "politics." The larger group here is massivecraft, and because massivecraft is not an organized entity, discounting staff, it would be better to refer to factions as Kingdoms, and I will do so in this thread.

Factions is more than PVP. It is the simulated development of society through different mediums; talking, PVP, RP, building, trading, etc. Minecraft is MORE than a game. No game is really, "just a game." Every game forms unique connections, whether they be inside or outside of the game, related to the game, that are UNDENIABLY STRONG, AND UNALIENABLE FROM THAT GAME. Envision a scenario where PVP only happened 24/7, where small groups of pvpers bashed against each other regularly without any semblance of other activity nor organization. Sound familiar? Minigames and KitPVP are what come to mind, right? Now think about people building floating obsidian boxes and skilled redstoners building cannon large enough to blow those boxes to hell. Think about the trade networks alone, even in this more mindless version of factions. Now think about a themed game, where in addition to skilled redstoners and complex trade networks, we have RPers, who are really just normal people who cover themselves in another set of emotion, and PVPers, because cannon isn't needed, who are just normal people who deprive themselves of much of their natural emotion.

I ask you to remember that MASSIVECRAFT IS THE FACTIONS RPG. That both RP and PVP are essentially intertwined into massivecraft, that factions involves organized groups, politics, trade. Factions is both RP and PVP at once. There's a reason why games like WoW are still called RPGS. You play as a character in a simulated world. *cough cough* minecraft *cough cough.* By simply playing minecraft, you play an RPG and are an RPer. The idea that RP and PVP are mutually exclusive groups is preposterous. Both RP and PVP are part of FACTIONS.

Remember another thing: There's a person there, behind that screen. Each name is a person who has their own feelings. Passions. Emotions. Drives. Challenges. Each person has come here to talk and be with other people. And so you have to treat them like it. Like it or not, everyone has emotions. We are people, here at this web of false xenophobia we call present-day Massivecraft. Each person is more than a name. We are all here in Massivecraft. If everything is deleted, we are still Massivecraft players.

I will ask you a question:

WHAT IS THE PURPOSE OF FACTIONS?

This is a question that the people of Massivecraft have come to regard as PVP. But if you look around the internet, watch videos, play different kinds of factions for yourself, I think that you'll come to find that the purpose of factions is TO BE THE VERY BEST FACTION, whether through PVP or RP. They are only different mediums to express emotion.

People won't remember what you said, or what you did, but they will remember how you made them feel. And understanding the simple concept that Minecraft is more than a game, that Factions is more than PVP, is important to creating a feeling that people won't ever forget. The REAL Massivecraft experience.
 
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That it will take an IDEA rather than a solution to solve the divide, and that idea is that both RP and PVP are parts of factions.
@jes_
 
That it will take an IDEA rather than a solution to solve the divide, and that idea is that both RP and PVP are parts of factions.
@jes_
You'd have to make actual doable suggestions if you want something to happen though. Fancy rhetoric may sound nice, but it won't really go anywhere unless you have a course of action people can take.

Currently, steps have already been taken to connect the two with the Crisis of Kings event.
 
Not really @Enkiduu there's more to connecting the communities then some kind of event. Racism won't be healed unless we realize we're all human beings. That's all it will take. The divide won't be healed unless we realize we're all Massivecraft players. That's the price of interconnection. The change needs to be the mindset, not the content.
 
Not really @Enkiduu there's more to connecting the communities then some kind of event. Racism won't be healed unless we realize we're all human beings. That's all it will take. The divide won't be healed unless we realize we're all Massivecraft players. That's the price of interconnection. The change needs to be the mindset, not the content.
uh huh
 
Not really @Enkiduu there's more to connecting the communities then some kind of event. Racism won't be healed unless we realize we're all human beings. That's all it will take. The divide won't be healed unless we realize we're all Massivecraft players. That's the price of interconnection. The change needs to be the mindset, not the content.
I'm not asking you to think of new events or content, I'm asking what you expect people to do. The change needs to be the mindset, yes, but simply wanting that does no good. How do you wish for it to actually be achieved? Again, what course of action do you want people to take?
 
This is meant to make people think. There's a reason why I didn't post this in Features and Ideas. There is no feature that accurately summarizes a mindset, rather, they will proceed from thought. When enough people have read and understood the thread, then ideas will come naturally. I'm not here to propose a substance, rather to change a way of thinking, unless we're holding a Massivecraft seminar.
 
All people need to do is think. To talk to each other. To open up to other people. That's literally it. We as Massivecraft players need to have the realization that we are all massivecraft players and people. All I'm really suggesting here is that by virtue of remembering that we are all humans, we should respect each other. Let RPers do what they want in the factions worlds because both RP and PVP are factions. And let PVPers experience RP for themselves because it's just another medium. But this stems from the mindset. Action follows thought.
 
So we have feelings, I got that



Can we have feelings in Regalia?
 
A few months ago, I probably would've agreed with you, but I think the crisis of kings event has already started the process of connecting the PVP and RP community. If crisis of kings ends up being successful (which I think it's safe to say it already is), I'd be willing to bet the game and lore staff will continue adding more and more content to further connect the two communities, so we just gotta be patient.
 
Crisis of kings in my opinion is the remedy to the void between Pvp and rp, already I have noticed an enormous change and excitement in the server in general, allot of former players have returned
 
Has anyone stopped to think if we even need to remedy the divide? I mean it sounds great in theory but servers with multiple game mode, (creative, mini games, factions, survival, etc) don't have an issue with the divide. Wev been focusing on how to fix it, but the question is IS IT BROKEN IN THE FIRST PLACE? If it's not broken, don't fix it
 
Has anyone stopped to think if we even need to remedy the divide? I mean it sounds great in theory but servers with multiple game mode, (creative, mini games, factions, survival, etc) don't have an issue with the divide. Wev been focusing on how to fix it, but the question is IS IT BROKEN IN THE FIRST PLACE? If it's not broken, don't fix it
If the server is loosing it's player-base, then yes, it's broken...

On the other hand I'm really loving the CoK! It's brought back many old/inactive players to the community.
 
C0K is bringing back old players, but tbh, how does it bring any players from rp to survival? Also @aprader1 Those servers are DESIGNED that way. We're supposed to be united.
 
If the server is loosing it's player-base, then yes, it's broken...

On the other hand I'm really loving the CoK! It's brought back many old/inactive players to the community.
we have already stated as someone above said is we are MAINTAINING players, not losing, so this is invalid.
 
1. The problem with RPers staying in Regalia is simply that this server isn't designed that way. It just isn't. It's not one of those servers where Prison people and Factions people are just separate. It exists in the same world, the same lore, at least technically, and in the same world, and yet both have no respect for the other.

2.The problem with maintaining players is that it maintains the status quo. Nothing new happens. In factions a bunch of PVPers mindlessly clickspamming, and in Regalia a bunch of RPers playing large-scale D&D. This server isn't meant to be separate.
 
C0K is bringing back old players, but tbh, how does it bring any players from rp to survival? Also @aprader1 Those servers are DESIGNED that way. We're supposed to be united.
As far as I can tell, a lot of the RP players don't want anything to do with PVP. There are mainly PVP factions and there are mainly RP factions. There are a few mixed, here and there, but forcing factions to have both or getting rid of factions will just drive more people away. Everybody is different and not everyone can win from what you're suggesting. And making all of the PVP players RP is probably not a good idea. Either way, not everyone wants to change. The server is losing people, but there are a lot of different reasons why. Don't just assume that everyone wants the divide to be fixed, because they might not.
 
That's the point of the thread. To make people realize that both RP and PVP are factions.
 
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That's the point of the thread. To make people realize that both RP and PVP are factions.
RP is factions? Wait what? I haven't even been to my f home in months! Or talked to my Faction really... I fail to see how these are both factions and, no offense, you have failed to provide solid, factual reasons to prove this point.
 
That's the point of the thread. To make people realize that both RP and PVP are factions.
The problem is that everyone has their own opinion. There are very stubborn people out there, me being one of those people. People will refuse to do what you're suggesting and eventually just leave the server. People won't do what they don't want to. It's essentially the power of the human brain. And considering the sheer amount of willpower that humans have shown proves what I'm saying. A lot of people aren't going to follow through with this and in the end we'll lose more players.
 
That's the point of the thread. To make people realize that both RP and PVP are factions.
I think one thing is though is that you can live in one and ignore the other, like in WoW you have to go to the towns (RP) to fix gear/buy sell and regroup, in massive theres nothing like that
 
C0K is bringing back old players, but tbh, how does it bring any players from rp to survival? Also @aprader1 Those servers are DESIGNED that way. We're supposed to be united.
Do you have any ideas as to how we could get roleplayers more interested in Survival/Factions? If so, I'd be interested to hear them.
Has anyone stopped to think if we even need to remedy the divide? I mean it sounds great in theory but servers with multiple game mode, (creative, mini games, factions, survival, etc) don't have an issue with the divide. Wev been focusing on how to fix it, but the question is IS IT BROKEN IN THE FIRST PLACE? If it's not broken, don't fix it
At our last meeting staff/community meeting, a few weeks ago, the topic of minigames was brought up and Marty said that there's no point in doing something if other servers do it better. I actually agree with this. I think the part of Massive lots of us cling to is that it's unique. It has that medieval vibe that we all love, and without the roleplay community, we would have lost that. That's why I set up Crisis of Kings and am going to continue to add to it as long as it's popular.
 
Do you have any ideas as to how we could get roleplayers more interested in Survival/Factions? If so, I'd be interested to hear them.

At our last meeting staff/community meeting, a few weeks ago, the topic of minigames was brought up and Marty said that there's no point in doing something if other servers do it better. I actually agree with this. I think the part of Massive lots of us cling to is that it's unique. It has that medieval vibe that we all love, and without the roleplay community, we would have lost that. That's why I set up Crisis of Kings and am going to continue to add to it as long as it's popular.
Sounds like good reasons and what MonMarty said makes a lot of sense. Thanks!
 
Tbh it might be better just to close the thread because no one actually gets the point of said thread.
 
And it's exactly what I mean. I'm not saying we should DO minigames, I'm advising against it. Blind PVP is basically minigames+KitPVP. I need to go back to English school...
 
Racism won't be healed unless we realize we're all human beings.
Its never a great thing if you have to bring up racism tbh

That's the point of the thread. To make people realize that both RP and PVP are factions.
Okay but why would you take the risk of building and role playing in your own constructed city when you can have the professionally built and staff maintained RP of Regalia? Having Regalia is what stuck a knife in factions overall, and unfortunately that wont change back.

The divide won't be healed unless we realize we're all Massivecraft players. That's the price of interconnection. The change needs to be the mindset, not the content.
But see there isnt any value for the RP community to change. I mean look at them, they have it pretty darn great. A professionally built city, a strict roleplay lore maintained by some amazing writers, and a lot of support. Why would they want to change? The value is only there for the PVP/Factions community. What would need to happen.... is something that is going to make a roleplayer get up and say "Gosh Regalia isnt as attractive as building my own faction and roleplaying there." because until we get something that makes people say that... then there wont be any more RP in the factions world than there is right now.

Tbh it might be better just to close the thread because no one actually gets the point of said thread.
I dont entirely understand the point of this thread either. The OP appeared to be started out as a rant, then turned into some sort of... pep thing.. idk
 
Like how someone is using their talents in poetic English. Quite blown out of proportion though. Also I see your point, I just don't find it valid. Your point is quite broad, we can't solve an issue just by being united and caring for another person's feelings. Sorry that I came off as rude, but that's the point I'm making. I don't even see why you are trying to make Massivecraft into a kind of edgy art. Also you fix racism by not bringing up race and seeing people as individuals.

Anyways it's obvious what would get RPers interested in faction survival, which to be honest CoK isn't the answer. CoK only makes PVP more interesting for those who are already into PVP. It enriches Factions in a ways, but not in the way that would please a RPer. Sadly RPers have grown too use to the protection of Regalia, therefore they won't seek the danger of survival Factions. So when I say it's obvious what would get RPers interested, I'm saying nothing will interest them. That is unless they grow bored of RP and get curious. By my opinion a course we could take is merely improving factions, which is the course staff is taking now. The CoK is the first step. It brings a unique new activity that actually represents the way of Massivecraft.

It will also capture the interest of what will actually fix factions, new players. From what I've seen we gain a good amount of new players everyday, but all they do is run around the faction worlds willy nilly, get killed, and quit. We need to get them to join an actual Faction where they can learn more about the server and become new members of the community. But what I find daunting is keeping the veteran players. They are the ones who will teach the new players and play along side them, making them a strong asset to making the Factions worlds more popular. What I find worrying is just accidentally making an improvement seem more like an unpleasant change rather than a benefit. Bringing new players will create an impact on the faction worlds, so this is a step I believe shouldn't be prioritized, but instead another step.

So mainly we just need to improve the factions world, but maintain the server's uniqueness. It's what glued me to this server and why I joined the community. I often don't think about how to improve the factions world so I can't give an idea right off the bat, since I often think about how to fix the economy, but improving factions and making it more exciting is what will make it more popular. CoK won't bring RPers to Factions, but it's already making factions more exciting and enriches what Factions is actually meant for. @TMI_Lord_Khan was correct when he said that the meaning of the Factions world is to fight and be the best faction, therefore competition is what makes Factions even better. When we improve Factions and make it something great, we will then have something for even new players to see and want to experience.
 
This thread feels like it comes from good intentions, but is ultimately unnecessary. RP and PvP might both be part of Factions in some interpretation with a lot of fancy words or bending the definitions around, but when you use the common/colloquial definitions of RP and PvP as it is used on the server, then that simply doesn't hold up. When people say RP on this server, they almost never mean the grinding aspect of the server such as McMMO, they mean the process of making a character, going to Regalia, and interacting with other player made characters there within the confines of the server's rules and lore. That is entirely separate from what PvP is on this server, which in it's major form is battles between factions, or in the more minor form, small skirmishes between individual players in the Wilderness.

Crisis of Kings seeks to lightly bind the two together, so actions in one realm can make a meaningful difference in the the other. So far, I think it is doing a fine job, and hopefully as more become aware of it, more great houses will join, more backstory and lore will be made canon from the actions of players in the survival world (something that was unprecedented until this as far as I'm aware), and large and enjoyable PvP battles will be fought.

While I get that this thread doesn't intend to propose a "solution" or feature, it seems to me that CoK takes a lot of the principles of your idea and implements them.
 
I'm just tired of arguing my point. Really though this thread isn't getting anywhere. Factions is player-to-player interaction in groups. RP is interaction in the medium of Roleplay. PVP is interaction in the medium of Player-versus-Player combat. Done. This is as simple as I can get the definitions down to.
 
I'm just tired of arguing my point. Really though this thread isn't getting anywhere. Factions is player-to-player interaction in groups. RP is interaction in the medium of Roleplay. PVP is interaction in the medium of Player-versus-Player combat. Done. This is as simple as I can get the definitions down to.

Well that seems a bit more clear than before. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you're trying to persuade us that the factions plugin should be used for roleplay, not just PvP and survival, is that right?