Archived Massive Magic Brainstorming - Why Not?

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CFLPlayer

CFLPlayer

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So! MassiveMagic is a plugin presumably under creation atm to bring something new and amazing to MassiveCraft. But this would be pretty hard to do alone for a coder (I imagine) especially within the confines of our lore universe. Therefore! Why shouldn't we at least try and spark some ideas? After all we are a community, so why not being all of us together to brainstorm? I've seen a lot of threads about this magic plugin, but they've been focused mainly on pleasing audiences with (I mean nothing rude by this) conventional ways of using magic. Massive isn't about doing the norm, it's about thinking outside the box.

I'd like to kick this thread off by discussing how a few magic ideas could be introduced.

Let's begin with shadow magic, now some of us may be thinking, 'easy, solve it with unlimited ended pearls' nup, for 1 shadow magic travelling isn't instantaneous, time passes the same in the void and Aloria. And 2 that is kinda boring and done by other magic plugins. How do we fix this? How about this:

Okay, so let's say you get a limited range. Let's say that my range is 6 horizontal blocks, I hold the sneak button and punch the block I'm ontop of(triggering the 'spell') now let's say I look around me within the 6 blocks horizontal range I have and right click looking closest to the 3rd block in my range. Using a calculation to workout the time it would take to walk those three blocks, I would have to wait to teleport those 3 blocks. During this time I'd be invulnerable and invisible, (after all you'd be in the void).

Now using this premise, let's say I want to go through a wall, let's say it's 3 blocks thick, my range is 4 blocks, if I look at the wrong spot, I'll be teleported into the wall (this gives the risks mentioned in the lore), if I position my aim right I'll be teleported to the nearest block on my y coordinates to where I was looking on the other side of the wall.

On top of this, if this idea does get put in place, how will it be balanced for pvp? Well, let's make it risky, for the next 2 mins after using shadow meld you are 50% more vulnerable to player damage, and using shadow meld takes up food (no matter what traits you have), the better your shadow magic skill is the less food you lose, on top of this, if you run out of food, you use health instead.

I believe this could be implemented, the time at which it takes to travel blocks is easy enough to work out, the aim of the spell though is a little trickier. The observant people reading this will have noticed that when using f3 you can see the block you're looking at, this helps with aim without the problem of a wall. But with a wall in the way it also helps, you'd be able to calculate the nearest block (on the same y coordinate you're stood on) that isn't obstructed on its top face (the face that would point upwards [if you didn't know]), this means that hypothetically my idea is feasible!

Now to see what you can come up with, post your ideas, reason them and discuss them with others! Please don't be rude in critiquing, but also don't be sore in accepting 'bad' criticism. Now please do as I say, this way we help our brilliant tech team build an enjoyable plugin for us to use. Thanks for reading

-CFL

Some people I want to see the opinions of @PariahFolk @Medvekoma @Kikopuz @Oblivaify[/USER [USER=5391]@JoyShake[/USER]
 
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I'm bored so I thought I'd post another idea on how magic should be distributed, just cus I'm bored, here it is:

Quests! Everyone loves em, sure they're buggy and odd on occasion but before any type of magic plugin is worked on they'll fix it up first, right? So why not have quests to fulfil, except (for rp purposes) they're not lore binding. What I mean by this is that the fact that a player does this quest does not make the character they play a magic user, it could be, but if it's not then it shouldn't be enforced. On another note, these quests shouldn't tie into a characters reasoning for having magic at all, they're more ooc quests than anything.

Okay? So great, quests... But I don't want to go here, get that. I want to practise! So, this is a little example of what these quests could be. The starting quest for shadow mages (I read this in lore) could be to make them do tasks with the blindness effect. This is fun, unique and interesting. Along with lore compliant. As always, thanks for reading
-CfL
 
MassiveMagic as a plugin in development was scrapped almost a year ago I think. No work has been done, not even pre-conceptualization.
 
CFLPlayer said:
Still, can we at least brainstorm? Or should we stop hoping?
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You can brainstorm, I just can't promise it will actually lead to anything. Then again, brainstorms existing hurts no-one and it's better to have it all recorded if we ever do something, than not to have it.
 
In terms of execution, I would have thought the magic plugin would be more word based, much like commands, except with more arcane, magical sounding spellwords. Then you can have the words be hidden so people would have to find them (through questing or whatever) or have others teach them. The words might even be unique to each player so that they can't create a cheatsheet. Plus, it would take time to type out or "cast" the spells, just like how a mage needs to concentrate and prepare spells.
 
Enkiduu said:
In terms of execution, I would have thought the magic plugin would be more word based, much like commands, except with more arcane, magical sounding spellwords. Then you can have the words be hidden so people would have to find them (through questing or whatever) or have others teach them. The words might even be unique to each player so that they can't create a cheatsheet. Plus, it would take time to type out or "cast" the spells, just like how a mage needs to concentrate and prepare spells.
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Mages don't necessarily use incantations all the time. Hand gestures too.
 
CFLPlayer said:
But you can just pretype the command and then roll back the message...
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The way I think of it, it'd be more complicated than that. Like, it wouldn't be a single simple command to do a spell. If you wanted to use shadow magic, for example, you'd have to type out location/distance and such, with each being its own word. Think in-game commands, except fully with words instead of numbers.
 
Enkiduu said:
The way I think of it, it'd be more complicated than that. Like, it wouldn't be a single simple command to do a spell. If you wanted to use shadow magic, for example, you'd have to type out location/distance and such, with each being its own word. Think in-game commands, except fully with words instead of numbers.
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Basically, you want to take away any skill involved with the magic (learning to aim it) and replace it with a tp command with different words...
 
CFLPlayer said:
Basically, you want to take away any skill involved with the magic (learning to aim it) and replace it with a tp command with different words...
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Do I detect hostility? I'm only giving ideas.

Anyway, would a command-based system be any less skillful than a clicking one? I would think that it'd require more skills since you'd have to do some math to figure things out, as well as remembering the words involved.
 
How would some of the more complicated, and possibly unbalanced magics work? Things such as Ethereal Weaponry, or Anti-Magic could easily reap and destroy scaling in any way, as you can summon weapons at will, or destroy people's ability to even cast. Not to mention, people develop their gestures and words through their teachings, and is not always just something you learn, I am pretty sure. That is how someone who does jazz hands to summon magic stones will not be able to clap and summon magic stones. Not only this, but as cool as it is, PvP'rs are sort of enraged at how their pizza is getting more and more toppings.
 
Anima_Vendit said:
How would some of the more complicated, and possibly unbalanced magics work? Things such as Ethereal Weaponry, or Anti-Magic could easily reap and destroy scaling in any way, as you can summon weapons at will, or destroy people's ability to even cast. Not to mention, people develop their gestures and words through their teachings, and is not always just something you learn, I am pretty sure. That is how someone who does jazz hands to summon magic stones will not be able to clap and summon magic stones. Not only this, but as cool as it is, PvP'rs are sort of enraged at how their pizza is getting more and more toppings.
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If gestures are to be used in such a direct fashion, instead of clicking, then surely you'd have to specify what gestures to use etc. As useful as this may be from a rp perspective, using it for utility is lacking, that is why putting in a simplistic method of casting is good. You can type your emoted spell gesture and then use the simplistic mechanics to act out the spell. Taking away the hassle of specifying the gesture directly from using the spell mechanic. On another hand you could just add a command that speaks an emote as soon as casting starts.

Then disable its use in combat at all, let them vote on it.

Well Ethereal magic just gives you armour and weaponry and automatically fits you with it. The quality/material can depend on the casters skill. But it would be one of the easiest to do I think...

Anti magic is tricky (thanx for bringing it up) mmo's have been using silencing spells etc for years and the effects of their findings are that you keep a decent duration on how long the silence lasts. For the antimage shields have a duration on how long they can last. Antimage aren't immune to magic at all so vulnerabilities such as durations of castingabd maybe even a cool down? Should be taken into consideration.
 
Enkiduu said:
Do I detect hostility? I'm only giving ideas.

Anyway, would a command-based system be any less skillful than a clicking one? I would think that it'd require more skills since you'd have to do some math to figure things out, as well as remembering the words involved.
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It's in no way hostile just a contradictory argument. Surely a command based system is easier you just do basic addition on your current coordinates to tp to a position. It requires a lot less skill. Remembering the words involved seems quite simple considering the teaching dictates it (you choose it yourself).
 
CFLPlayer said:
It's in no way hostile just a contradictory argument. Surely a command based system is easier you just do basic addition on your current coordinates to tp to a position. It requires a lot less skill. Remembering the words involved seems quite simple considering the teaching dictates it (you choose it yourself).
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If we're comparing the amount of skill needed, what alternative are you proposing? I was under the impression that I was comparing typing commands to clicking blocks.

Of course, I'm not saying that the system would be entirely command based. I can imagine situations where one might need both commands and aiming. Like, say Fire magic typing commands to set a fireball's size and intensity, and then clicking to fire it.

For the words, though, since we're doing idle brainstorming, I'll add more detail. Although in RP one's character would choose their own words, I would think this would be impractical for a magic plugin. There'd either be a set of words that everyone uses or some way to generate different sets of words for each player (Perhaps pseudo-randomly generated based on their names, or the first character of their names or some such).
 
Enkiduu said:
If we're comparing the amount of skill needed, what alternative are you proposing? I was under the impression that I was comparing typing commands to clicking blocks.

Of course, I'm not saying that the system would be entirely command based. I can imagine situations where one might need both commands and aiming. Like, say Fire magic typing commands to set a fireball's size and intensity, and then clicking to fire it.

For the words, though, since we're doing idle brainstorming, I'll add more detail. Although in RP one's character would choose their own words, I would think this would be impractical for a magic plugin. There'd either be a set of words that everyone uses or some way to generate different sets of words for each player (Perhaps pseudo-randomly generated based on their names, or the first character of their names or some such).
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How are any command based spells used in fast paced scenarios. For most people it would just be a faff to type out the exact size and shape of a fireball, were in predestining them by I dunno making a more simplistic scrolling system? Binding slots to certain sizes etc makes it easier. In a chase, does a wind Mage want to stop, pause for a moment and think about their pseudo words to push their enemies back? This slow pace may be tolerated by some but isn't the point of a plugin like this for all people to enjoy it?
 
My opinion eh? Sure.

I am not pro magic. I think it'd cause alot of lag. As a person who get daily crashes, ghosting problems and other lag problems, I do not think I'd like the idea of magic plugin. It feels like it'd be abused alot and causing lag. It's a cool idea nevertheless, but I think traits and mpm is enough, and there is other things I prefer coming to the server than this. I mean have anyone seen them rope mods? Those look epic.
 
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