Archived Faction Pricing

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Zpade

Zpade

Edosaku Shinji, Head of the Edosaku Clan
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MassiveCraft has grown significantly ever since I left. Roleplay appears to be big now, new empires around, and much more. But I'm not posting this to list off the changes over the course of my eight month leave. This is, mainly, about what hasn't: the price of a faction.

Despite the growth of the "physical" realm(as in more continents and what not), and the expansion of the server itself, along with the many people that are now first joining, the price for a faction is still.. 200 silver. Factions have been at 200 silver for the past.. year now? And we only had, and correct me if I'm wrong, Ceardia and Deandroc. We as a server were smaller then. And now? 4+ continents and what appears to be crowded faction claims left and right.

There was a reason it was placed at 200, and now I feel that it must be raised again.

I myself will suggest 275, if anything, but that's just me.

And you?
 
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I agree supported
 
I think that with the economy as screwy as it is, raising the price of factions may be beneficial. I have noticed that new players are more capable of raising their finances more quickly than in the past, in part due to the voting rewards.
 
This is mostly because of everyone selling their voting items, but I support.
 
I support this, it used to take awhile to earn money. Now it only takes maybe two weeks or so yo earn 150 silver or more because of the voting system. Raising the prices for factions might help, especially with new players starting factions within weeks of just starting.
 
i disagree with this, for the most part, if the price is raised to 275, that gives the amount of money to the person that sold it, to make a new one, with a 75s profit. Then to those who got this money, can re-make a faction and resell it again for another 75s profit.

NOT SUPPORTED
 
TylerJG92 said:
i disagree with this, for the most part, if the price is raised to 275, that gives the amount of money to the person that sold it, to make a new one, with a 75s profit. Then to those who got this money, can re-make a faction and resell it again for another 75s profit.

NOT SUPPORTED
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I am not sure what you mean? Perhaps try explaining it more thoroughly.

I am for raising it even more, perhaps even doubling the amount. Factions need to be something that take time to get. They are not nearly as precious as I would like them. If you screw up, you can just make a new one in a week or so. They have also become single man endeavors, ie: One person makes a faction, then, invites people to serve under them. It would nice to see ten people come together to buy a faction, perhaps then they will stick around a bit more.
 
JP1976 said:
I am not sure what you mean? Perhaps try explaining it more thoroughly.

I am for raising it even more, perhaps even doubling the amount. Factions need to be something that take time to get. They are not nearly as precious as I would like them. If you screw up, you can just make a new one in a week or so. They have also become single man endeavors, ie: One person makes a faction, then, invites people to serve under them. It would nice to see ten people come together to buy a faction, perhaps then they will stick around a bit more.
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i fell as though u can make money off this, makeing 75s off every new faction, if they get members and allys/truces, if im reading this correct, then if u have those then the price would be 275. and someone who is well know could easly do that, and sell the new one making another 75s profit on it... this could be used to make lots of money realy fast.
 
+Support, sometimes I feel that people are getting them to quickly because people are selling voting rewards for plentiful amounts, quickening their pace to 200 silver quickly.
 
TylerJG92 said:
i disagree with this, for the most part, if the price is raised to 275, that gives the amount of money to the person that sold it, to make a new one, with a 75s profit. Then to those who got this money, can re-make a faction and resell it again for another 75s profit.

NOT SUPPORTED
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They can only make one 75s profit. If you sell the previously purchased faction (the 200s one) for 275s, you get 75s. Unless you have enough money to pay for another faction, you will not even be able to pay for another one, and if you sell it, you would just gain back your lost 275s (assuming you sold the new faction for 275s again).
 
Would raising the founding price actually solve the problem though? There is already a high concentration of factions, this would not reduce that number, and often people will buy a faction from another rather than actually paying the two hundred to found one. When buying off another, the prices are very rarely over 200s, unless there is an adequate faction base accompaniment.
 
katiesc said:
I support this, it used to take awhile to earn money. Now it only takes maybe two weeks or so yo earn 150 silver or more because of the voting system. Raising the prices for factions might help, especially with new players starting factions within weeks of just starting.
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You can earn 150s in two weeks?... I did not know this.
 
I support this. We need to make the price of a faction so high that the newer players on Massive will understand and grasp the significance of owning one. A faction is not just something you can own and go on doing your normal routine with, nor is it just a "power boost". Leading a faction gives you a new way of playing minecraft. I know this might sound ridiculous to some of you, but think about it. Instead of getting wood or mining iron, as a faction leader you manage your members, assign ranks, create interfaction alliances, recruit new members, and basically run a small town. At the current 200s, new players to Massive are more likely to simply view owning a faction as a straight up "upgrade" from their current status, a statement that is completely wrong because they never realize that owning a faction brings along a entire host of responsibilities and jobs. Raising the price of factions will slowly bring the number of factions on the server down as well as helping newer players understand how much work is indeed going into good factions, so they can ask themselves "can I really run a good faction?" instead of making one and immediately running it into the ground.
 
Joshy54100 said:
They can only make one 75s profit. If you sell the previously purchased faction (the 200s one) for 275s, you get 75s. Unless you have enough money to pay for another faction, you will not even be able to pay for another one, and if you sell it, you would just gain back your lost 275s (assuming you sold the new faction for 275s again).
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you make no sence... technecly when u sell the first faction for 275, ten u will gain 75s profit while haveing 200s to make a new faction...
 
TylerJG92 said:
you make no sence... technecly when u sell the first faction for 275, ten u will gain 75s profit while haveing 200s to make a new faction...
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I think he means that when you have a faction, that you had bought for 200 silver, then sell it with an added 75 silver, which would make 275 silver, yes, you would gain 75 silver profit, but the seller would not instantly be able to just buy a new faction, unless they already had a spare 200 silver with them.
 
Teddie000 said:
I think he means that when you have a faction, that you had bought for 200 silver, then sell it with an added 75 silver, which would make 275 silver, yes, you would gain 75 silver profit, but the seller would not instantly be able to just buy a new faction, unless they already had a spare 200 silver with them.
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waht do you meen? they will have an aditional 275s... just another 75s. u guys are acting as if all you sell it for is 75... not 275... i dont understand why u peoiple think that...
 
No... Uhm... We mean that you /do/ sell it for 275s, but if you sell it, then want to buy a new faction, then sell that (to make profit) ou really wouldn't be able to. It takes a while to earn money, so it'd be tough to manage to have a spare 200s when you've just bought a new faction and are go to sell said faction, GAH, it's hard to explain.

TylerJG92
 
TylerJG92
It seems you are forgetting that to make a new faction will still cost 275s.
So even once you sell your own faction for the increased price of 275, (yes you now own 275s), you still have to buy one for 274s.
Where do you plan on buying a new faction for 200s?

THIS idea though is good. It will also mean newer players will join factions and we will see expansion of active and 'awesome' factions. (as opposed to people making their own fac)
Being a faction owner use to be respected, now every second man is a faction owner.. (exaggeration)
 
I completely agree with this. Aside from the fact that it will give current factions a boost in members and also create a larger sense of satisfaction in actually owning a faction, it will counteract some of the inflation on the server by increasing the money that is funneled out of it, and it will also cause existing factions to be worth more as the eventual supply of factions becomes less.
 
Supported
When most noobs join they immediatly want to create a faction but they don't realize that its costs lots of silver and requires lots of time because there are certain things that you and only you are able to do when leading a faction.
The raised price would allow for noobs who instantly want to create a faction to have time to think about the responsibilities and effort that comes with it.
I'm currently a faction leader atm and believe me its not what its cracked up to be especially in those early days of building and planning.
 
Supported

New players should join other factions before creating their own. Owning your own faction should not be in reach of new players. This is due to several reasons.

- New players don't know this community. They need to learn and understand this server, what the rules are, how we all play here. We do not want new people going out into the world scavaging the landscape for resources. (usualy doing lots of damige to terrain features)

- They aren't aware of the lore. It took me months to learn what I know now about the lore, and I still feel like I don't know what I need to know about it. New players need to understand the basics of the lore. Althought this problem has been adressed with the quests plugin, factions may contribute to this aswel.

Another problem we may have is space. Where will all these new factions go? I know we keep getting new world to expand to but, having so many faction means having many settlements. And I believe the staff encurages travel... So some distance between civilised regions may be beneficial to the roleplay aspect of the worlds. I believe bigger factions contribute to that.

The economy is changing. But do not take the premium feature in account on this topic. People who purchase premium are generaly people who have played here a while. I believe its safe to say that a 'new player' being premium is a rare thing. Non-premiums make money quiker than before. And raising the price due to that would be obvious (would it have happend already)

But enough reasoning now :P

I surport this. And I hope you all do too.
 
As i said in the parallel thread (merge them, maybe?) I Support this. I would even go higher, maybe 400 silver.
Orchoose another approach. Would it be possible to need 3or 4 people to be able to create a faction? It needs to be more than the average alt Level. Combined with maybe a 500 silver payment. After All, three or four dedicated players could easily get 500s but it would be hard to buy people for faction creating with that High a cost.
 
I general I like the idea of more expensive faction, will mean less hopefully. Supported.

Hiramas said:
As i said in the parallel thread (merge them, maybe?) I Support this. I would even go higher, maybe 400 silver.
Orchoose another approach. Would it be possible to need 3or 4 people to be able to create a faction? It needs to be more than the average alt Level. Combined with maybe a 500 silver payment. After All, three or four dedicated players could easily get 500s but it would be hard to buy people for faction creating with that High a cost.
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If you made it so you needed more than one person to make a faction then people with alts could make a money from people who need initial members. Also this would require more coding. The cost change is just a setting in the config.
 
Well,im not agree with this stupid idea ,in fact, this make me bad and only i have one thing to say....
BOOOO-GA-BOO-GA-BOO-GA!!
booga.gif

xd..talking serius,you arguments are correct,but you are always in perspective of premiuns.For No-premiuns is not too easy to gain 300 silver .Maybe will need increased the Faction Pricing,but not too much.
 
hector_campus said:
Well,im not agree with this stupid idea ,in fact, this make me bad and only i have one thing to say....
BOOOO-GA-BOO-GA-BOO-GA!!
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xd..talking serius,you arguments are correct,but you are always in perspective of premiuns.For No-premiuns is not too easy to gain 300 silver .Maybe will need increased the Faction Pricing,but not too much.
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I'm not premium, and I agree. Also its not meant to be easy to make a faction.
 
hector_campus said:
Well,im not agree with this stupid idea ,in fact, this make me bad and only i have one thing to say....
BOOOO-GA-BOO-GA-BOO-GA!!
View attachment 15541

xd..talking serius,you arguments are correct,but you are always in perspective of premiuns.For No-premiuns is not too easy to gain 300 silver .Maybe will need increased the Faction Pricing,but not too much.
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We are not all looking from the 'premium perspective'.

Gaining money in massive is tough, especialy for new people. When you stay around for a while you will learn new ways to gain money. and after playing some time... yes, 'then' you can make a faction together with some friends. (if that is truly your desire)
 
Overlordqwerty said:
I general I like the idea of more expensive faction, will mean less hopefully. Supported.



If you made it so you needed more than one person to make a faction then people with alts could make a money from people who need initial members. Also this would require more coding. The cost change is just a setting in the config.
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That is the reason i added a very High price, too. Even if someone should get 500 silver, he had to paythe guy providing the alts, too. That is just too expensive to be practical. As for the technical side of things, i Do Not Know enough about how much coding would be needed, but i think it could be done.
 
Hiramas said:
That is the reason i added a very High price, too. Even if someone should get 500 silver, he had to paythe guy providing the alts, too. That is just too expensive to be practical. As for the technical side of things, i Do Not Know enough about how much coding would be needed, but i think it could be done.
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I just don't think it really would work from a the game mechanic side of things, and its not really rp correct to have people come to a town to start it, then leave and the town still existing. Also that makes a faction 'worth' more that the creation cost so someone with alts could make factions and sell them. In general I just think it give too big an advantage to people with many alts. And remember nothing is really too expensive to be practical, they will just save up longer. Also there will be people willing to bring their alts online for 5 minutes for not much at all, so it will me more of an annoyance factor than a cost factor.
 
I understand your concerns. But that is the situation we have right now. The RP argument in terms of factions is really at the wrong place here. How often do people join a faction so a guy can claim a decent region and then they leave again? In my vicinity a guy bought a faction, got bored, sold it. The land lay there half finished. Then the guy came to my faction, got bored and bought another faction and is living in another place again. How long till he gets bored there?
You cannot mix game mechanics and RP without considering those people who use the game mechanics but do not RP.

Now to the game mechanics side:
And again talking about people with alts making money: How many people do have 4 alt accounts? Its not like an MMO where you can have 6 chars without cost. Every alt costs money. And now, how many people would be able to save up not only the 500 silver to pay for the faction creation, but also 100 or 200 silver to pay the people with alts?
Only because something is possible does not mean it is practical.
And if the people save up longer, then we reached the exact goal we wanted to! The number of new born-to-die factions is reduced! Either the player has enough friends by then to make a decent faction or he joined another one and does not need to create a new one. Perfect.
After all, nearly every MMO needs more than 2 people and a decent sum of money to create a guild. Never the less, guilds tend to be bigger than a single person with his alts.
The amount of money a player could make may be high, but the opportunities to do so would be very very very scarce.

For the technical side of things:
There are already commands in minecraft you have to confirm. Now, one player makes the faction create command and that gets written into the database. Now the plugin waits until confirmation from a Number of X players to confirm the creation with the same command. Should be possible.
 
Hiramas said:
And again talking about people with alts making money: How many people do have 4 alt accounts?
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I think Mecharic does...

Anyway the thing about making factions need more than one member to start them just seems pointless to me and its just a way for faction hoppers to make money and does not make sense. If 100 people band together and start a town, then 99 leave, its not really a town anymore.

Also, what about people who want a small faction of say, 3 people, what do they do? I think its just limits what people can do with factions. And you need to remember even if it is not that long to code it is still coding required where a cost increase is just a setting.
 
Zpade said:
MassiveCraft has grown significantly ever since I left. Roleplay appears to be big now, new empires around, and much more. But I'm not posting this to list off the changes over the course of my eight month leave. This is, mainly, about what hasn't: the price of a faction.

Despite the growth of the "physical" realm(as in more continents and what not), and the expansion of the server itself, along with the many people that are now first joining, the price for a faction is still.. 200 silver. Factions have been at 200 silver for the past.. year now? And we only had, and correct me if I'm wrong, Ceardia and Deandroc. We as a server were smaller then. And now? 4+ continents and what appears to be crowded faction claims left and right.

There was a reason it was placed at 200, and now I feel that it must be raised again.

I myself will suggest 275, if anything, but that's just me.

And you?
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Jomdorr made this post a day ago and got dislikes... Now you made this post and people agree? Whats wrong?
 
Overlordqwerty said:
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I am sorry, you are just repeating the same arguments without responding to me.
There is so much faction hopping going on at the moment. I described it for you above.
How is a faction that has been bought by one person and an alt a town? That is the situation now.
And then again, how long would you think it would take a person to collect the 500s plus paying the faction hoppers?
We considered the higher price to reduce small, quick dying factions that leave clutter all over the place.
We want to give factions more meaning. We want to make it a community thing again, not an egotrip like it is now often enough.

In my view, this would accomplish that in a better way than just making it more expensive.
As was said often enough, money seems to be no obstacle anymore.

Further, as I said, and you did not give me any counter argument, I do not believe there will be a significant market for faction hoppers because it is too expensive and too unpractical.
And declaring a tool which virtually every MMO uses to control guild and faction numbers useless is a little presumptuous, don't you think?
 
Guys... think bigger. 1,000s at least. Factions are the answer to our lack of a money sink on the server!
 
The major problem with the money sink argument is that the market is all about demand. If we dramatically increase the price, nobody will want to found a faction any more. If they still want a faction, they will try and look for a precreated one to buy. However, the owners will see this founding price rise dramatically, which in turn will cause the owners to hike up their asking price as well. The faction buyers will be discouraged, and the market will essentially stagnate. While in theory rising prices would create a better money sink, in reality, if done incorrectly, it would effectively remove a money sink.
 
It should be raised.
Since the members have 75s every month, there is more money around in the game. It's easier for non-members to earn money as well.
When I first joined, I had some issues with understanding the faction, rp and races. Being a fac, as a new-comer is recommended, before making your own fac.
 
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