Archived /f Merge Command [updated]

[Morbytogan]

I believe that the /f merge command would be a great asset to MassiveCraft. It would make for much easier merging, which is a common activity. It would work much like the allying system:

Faction A leader: /f merge FactionB
Faction B leader: /f merge FactionA

The larger faction's name, leader, and relations would be kept. It essentially puts all the members and land into one, larger faction.
EDIT

• Faction age = Oldest faction's
• Relation wishes both factions have set, some of them may even conflict. = Reset all relations to default
• Relation wished other factions have set towards one of the two merging factions. = ""
• Invited players = Reset
• Flags = Reset
• Faction permissions = Reset
• Faction home = Kept buy the larger faction
• Claims, in case there is not enough power = You would not be able to merge unless the total sum of the power is sufficient for the claims.

 

[Gerrior]

I like the idea but it would need more to it. The system would need more information so the "hitches" would be next to none existent. For example,
/f merge [faction name] into [faction name] - Faction wanting to merge or sending request to.
/f merge [faction name] accept - Host faction agreeing with the merge and will be the main faction.

 

[Razalith]

Just as a note the main faction would need to have enough power to absorb the claimed land. If you dont add that then you'll get factions making new ones shuttling players then absorbing to overclaim.

 

[Madus]

What should be done with the following data:

• Faction age
• Relation wishes both factions have set, some of them may even conflict.
  
• Relation wished other factions have set towards one of the two merging factions.
• Invited players
• Flags
• Faction permissions
• Faction home
• Claims, in case there is not enough power.

This suggestion is really incomplete. Think it through a bit more.

 

[Morbytogan]

• Faction age = Oldest faction's
• Relation wishes both factions have set, some of them may even conflict. = Reset all relations to default
  
• Relation wished other factions have set towards one of the two merging factions. = ""
• Invited players = Reset
• Flags = Reset
• Faction permissions = Reset
• Faction home = Kept buy the larger faction
• Claims, in case there is not enough power = You would not be able to merge unless the total sum of the power is sufficient for the claims.

 

[Sephite]

Good idea.. BUT

What if a smaller faction manages to get a bigger faction to want to merge with them under the smaller faction's lead? Just because you have more (maybe inactive) people and more land (maybe claimed in the past), doesn't automatically mean you are the stronger (more active) faction. (Aye, it does in most of the times, but not always.)

 

[Madus]

The /f invite list command has been updated to show ONLY the display names which should be less confusing I have just pushed it to GitHub https://github.com/TheEnderPrince/Factions

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That has absolutely nothing to do with this discussion. Keep the discussion on topic.

 

[TheEnderPrince]

That has absolutely nothing to do with this discussion. Keep the discussion on topic.

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I thought it did

 

[Mecharic]

Good idea.. BUT

What if a smaller faction manages to get a bigger faction to want to merge with them under the smaller faction's lead? Just because you have more (maybe inactive) people and more land (maybe claimed in the past), doesn't automatically mean you are the stronger (more active) faction. (Aye, it does in most of the times, but not always.)

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Then the larger faction gives leadership to the smaller faction's leader?

 

[MarkehMe]

Maybe this should be a process of the Faction picking which Faction to merge into.

This would then which Faction would keep their land and which would surrender their land.

For example Faction CatLovers leader MarkehMe requests a merge, /f merge DOGSRULE.

This means that CatLovers are requesting to merge into DOGSRULE. So therefore if all the players as a whole meet the prerequisites to merge into that Faction then CatLovers would disband upon DOGSRULE accepting the merge request (/f merge accept CatLovers), and the players would simply move into DOGSRULE.

We should probably then display to the leaders about the relationships that are different from the previous Faction.

 

[Aespair]

@Staff I believe that all the questions that Madus had have been answered, could you guys have another look at this please?

 

[Morbytogan]

@Staff @Cayorion @Lazzulai @Thortuna @MonMarty @Gethelp
so what do u guys think?

 

[Morbytogan]

Bump

 

[RockBottom]

Nice idea! What do you think would happen to ranks though? Who keeps leader?

 

[Morbytogan]

Nice idea! What do you think would happen to ranks though? Who keeps leader?

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I would make it so that the faction that originally had the most power would keep leadership

 

[Morbytogan]

@Staff @Cayorion @Lazzulai @Thortuna @MonMarty @Gethelp
Any further thoughts? I believe all questions have been answered

 

[Morbytogan]

@Game @Cayorion @Lazzulai @MonMarty @Gethelp
It's been several months now and this is still 'under review', and further thoughts?

 

[Spazzzzz]

it's a good idea. But isn't there already something like this with empires?

 

[Zacatero]

Invited players = Reset

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I think this would be better if it were like

Invited Players = Automatically invited to the combined faction.

 

[Sir_Daragon]

I think perms, flags, and invited player get reset for the "small" faction since they merge the adopting faction would be kept normal.

 

[falconhand]

One issue i see, but i understand why, but all relations would disappear? Everyone set to neutral? I see this as a potential way to exploit, and a inhibitor to faction growth, as that would void max tribute peace, since you changed relation. I see this as an exploit because factions could use an alt fac, and merge to remove enemies, such as Raptum.

 

[Zacatero]

One issue i see, but i understand why, but all relations would disappear? Everyone set to neutral? I see this as a potential way to exploit, and a inhibitor to faction growth, as that would void max tribute peace, since you changed relation. I see this as an exploit because factions could use an alt fac, and merge to remove enemies, such as Raptum.

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What about this scenario instead..

Faction A is merging into Faction B (Meaning that in the end, only faction B will exist)

Faction A is enemies with Raptum and Faction B is neutral. The merged faction is now enemies with Raptum
Faction A is allies with Raptum and Faction B is neutral. The merged faction is now allies with Raptum.
Faction A is enemies with Raptum. Faction B is allies with Raptum. The merged faction is now enemies with Raptum.
Faction A is allied with Raptum. Faction B is enemies with Raptum. The merged faction is now enemies with Ratptum.

That way enemies always prevails, you cant use this to get out of being enemies

Now comes the hard part which is.. what if a faction is in truce? Well i would think it would follow the same protocol as above.
Truce + Ally = Ally
Truce + Enemy = Enemy

BUT what if its a tribute enforced truce? Without, perhaps, a second truce relation that is solely used for surrender enforced truces, then we really dont have a way to automatically differentiate between a regular truce and a surrender enforced truce.

 

[falconhand]

I like this. Thanks for addressing my points!

 

[Savantly]

You guys are making this idea into a pluggin that is ultra refined (Complicated systems make coding take a lot more time..). There are only two major parts of a merger, Land and Members.

My Version:
Damorn makes a request via /f merge {Faction} for Divini to join them. If Divini accepts the following will happen:
- Damorn Absorbs Divini Members (All as Recruits)
- Land is Given to Damorn (Regardless of power, cuz they still have to pay tax)
- All perms, flags and relations of Divini are nullified, Current Damorn Relations, Flags and Permissions remain.
- Divini is disbanded.

In short, only transfer members and land. This version of a /f merge command uses far less staff time to produce, and gets the important part done. Sure someone could abuse this... But it would take a lot of time and money.

@Zacatero @Morbytogan @Madus @TheComputerGeek2

People can already evade an enemy relation by creating a new faction or joining a friends faction.
The "Exploit" already exists and it really doesn't hurt anything.@falconhand

 

[Sir_Daragon]

@Madus got any updates? Cause personaly i think this is a great improvent but clearly need more details. Anyway you can help us help you.

 

[Vivamente]

Why does this not implement a nation feature, where one faction joins the other and is selected for farming or otherwise, giving both faction leaders a "councillor" rank, meaning that they have the decision to pull out of this larger alliance or "nation" as a whole, this would also make great implementation for role-playing experience.

Cudos to you good sir.

 

[Mocaro]

This is amazing, Morby. I'd love for this to be implemented.

 

[littleshep101]

What about this scenario instead..

Faction A is merging into Faction B (Meaning that in the end, only faction B will exist)

Faction A is enemies with Raptum and Faction B is neutral. The merged faction is now enemies with Raptum
Faction A is allies with Raptum and Faction B is neutral. The merged faction is now allies with Raptum.
Faction A is enemies with Raptum. Faction B is allies with Raptum. The merged faction is now enemies with Raptum.
Faction A is allied with Raptum. Faction B is enemies with Raptum. The merged faction is now enemies with Ratptum.

That way enemies always prevails, you cant use this to get out of being enemies

Now comes the hard part which is.. what if a faction is in truce? Well i would think it would follow the same protocol as above.
Truce + Ally = Ally
Truce + Enemy = Enemy

BUT what if its a tribute enforced truce? Without, perhaps, a second truce relation that is solely used for surrender enforced truces, then we really dont have a way to automatically differentiate between a regular truce and a surrender enforced truce.

Click to shrink...

Should be....
Faction B's relations stay the same and Faction A's relations get deleted and get merged to Faction B's unless in the
Faction A is enemies with Raptum. Faction B is allies with Raptum. The merged faction is now enemies with Raptum.
that funtions would be put into effect

 

[Madus]

I have been tagged. First of all. I am no longer tech staff, so anything I say is purely the opinion/guess of a player with some technical knowledge and experience with the the Tech Department.

I still think some of my questions remain, because there is no clear answer. You don't have to come up with an answer I just tried to make a point.

I also don't like the idea (remember, purely my own opinion). If you don't want to go through the hassle of reclaiming some land manually and asking your members to switch faction, then you don't deserve to merge anyways. If you don't have enough power, then tough luck. If you can't get your members to switch then they don't like the idea (or are inactive) and would leave you anyways.

Finally this won't be implemented even if we decide this is a good idea because tech staff is too busy. I know that is sad and what we always say. But that is the case when we are so understaffed.