Archived Entering Faction Territory On Screen Messages

[Joshy54100]

In case you didn't know, MassiveCraft recently added a cool feature to show the faction name and description on your screen when you enter that faction. Here's two screenshots.

This is right in the middle of the screen, and it's very large and lasts for about three seconds (I think so, not entirely sure).

For player's who don't PvP and only build or RP, I can see why they would like this feature. It is useful, and it adds a another level of immersion to the game. But for PvPers, it's very annoying when you're fighting near the edge of another faction's territory and this message keeps spamming you.
Just earlier today, I raided Magnanimus and fought @Cata. We were both spammed a lot by this message and it made the fight a lot less enjoyable because of this.

My suggestion is to make this feature toggleable, or remove it entirely (Only do this if toggleing it isn't feasible). This feature is really cool, but it's just not something that I find useful enough to want.

Leave your opinion on this matter below. Please, have a civil discussion, realize we can have different opinions and still love each other. No flame.

 

[CanteringCodfish]

As I have said before, I too think it is best to make the messages toggleable. Personally, I liked it best when there was just the chat message, but I know some of my friends think otherwise.

 

[Kezlok]

As usual people dont like change. Give it a week or so. But is it better than getting your chat completely spammed?

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When PvP'ing I'd rather get my chat spammed than the middle of my screen where my enemy is supposed to be. It's not that I don't like the feature, it's really cool but not in PvP. I vote for le toggle.

 

[Gwyndo]

IDEA HERE -

If you have PVP enabled/active then the message will not display.
If you do not have PVP enabled/active; it will display.

If it is displaying, and you enter PVP, then it is removed regardless of how long it would have remained.

*Along with a toggle, because of darkrooming not activating pvp

PROBLEM SOLVED BUT IMMERSION KEPT =D

Thoughts?
@LeafMC @LizmanOfAloria @GameFlame @ShadowedSkies @Cruallassar @qgmk @65jes89 @TearDownTheClub @Akmer007 @cooldudeooo @Joshy54100
(Tagging the voters to see their opinions)

@Madus *Edit* Ty for removing your rating

 

[Kezlok]

IDEA HERE -

If you have PVP enabled then the message will not display.
If you do not have PVP enabled; it will display.

If it is displaying, and you enter PVP, then it is removed regardless of how long it would have remained.

PROBLEM SOLVED BUT IMMERSION KEPT =D

Thoughts?
@LeafMC @LizmanOfAloria @GameFlame @ShadowedSkies @Cruallassar @qgmk @65jes89 @TearDownTheClub @Akmer007 @cooldudeooo @Joshy54100
(Tagging the voters to see their opinions)

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Would still prefer a manual toggle (⌣_⌣")
Just mah opinion.

 

[Gwyndo]

As usual people dont like change. Give it a week or so. But is it better than getting your chat completely spammed?

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I have to disagree, as it can definetely be improved upon. I can understand how insanely anoying it must be trying to PVP with that in the middle of your screen. Everything has room for improvement, and *edit* I think that / in my opinion *edit* the idea that it won't appear if you have combat-active is a pretty decent "fix" for the many people who appear to not like the practicality of this.

 

[feiooos]

IDEA HERE -

If you have PVP enabled then the message will not display.
If you do not have PVP enabled; it will display.

If it is displaying, and you enter PVP, then it is removed regardless of how long it would have remained.

PROBLEM SOLVED BUT IMMERSION KEPT =D

Thoughts?
@LeafMC @LizmanOfAloria @GameFlame @ShadowedSkies @Cruallassar @qgmk @65jes89 @TearDownTheClub @Akmer007 @cooldudeooo @Joshy54100
(Tagging the voters to see their opinions)

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What about darkrooming? Same thing happens without being pvp enabled. I vote for the toggle. And make this change fast please!

As usual people dont like change. Give it a week or so. But is it better than getting your chat completely spammed?

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Well, as usual this was not thought to Pvpers... Give it a week or so and people will still complain about it :/

 

[ZiHAMMER]

Just reduce the size and move it to the top.

 

[TylerJG92]

I think that making it toggleable would be a good idea, like you said @Madus most people dont like change, so allow the people of the server to make it so it dosent change. +1 support

 

[Knyxo]

@HandsomeJack @feiooos @ZIHAMMER1411 Please explain your disagree ratins, I just asked a question.
@Knyxor You rating makes even less sense

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Why the subject should be read again :
It's not a matter of not liking change. He even said he thinks it's a cool feature. His issue is that it's annoying in Pvp, not that he hates it because it's change. The main idea is that it should be toggleable, not removed completely because he hates it.

To clarify my actual opinion, I actually like it, and would probably leave it on if I had the option. But to me it kind of goes without saying that it'd be very annoying to somebody that Pvps on a regular basis so I think the option should exist. One line in the chat box is hardly spam and never bothers anyone as far as I know.

 

[Gwyndo]

@HandsomeJack @feiooos @ZIHAMMER1411 Please explain your disagree ratins, I just asked a question.
@Knyxor You rating makes even less sense

We also had a lot of people complaining about the new chat system (okay some of that was changed), but now people is used to it.
Also this was not thought for PvPers, RPers, Builders or someone specific. It was thought for everyone using factions as nice way of displaying messages, since you might not always see it and your chat will not be so messy.
The disadvantage of getting spammed in PvP was not something we thought of when implementing this feature (admitted).


Not possible currently. Maybe go nag Dinnerbone to add that

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I did give reason for my rating, and your reason doesn't state why it disagrees with me specifically.

@Madus *Edit* Ty for removing your rating

 

[Jackmo_Jones]

I'll start by saying OMG yes it is so annoying. Up until recently my DR was only partially claimed (around my beacon) so my screen would constantly get spammed with the message every couple seconds which is SO annoying. On top of that apparently Atherias description is too long so it doesn't all fit on the screen making the feature kind of pointless.

My idea for a fix is simple and has already been stated by others. Either make it MUCH smaller or just put it back in chat where it belongs.

 

[MonMarty]

I think that making it toggleable would be a good idea, like you said @Madus most people dont like change, so allow the people of the server to make it so it dosent change. +1 support

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If the server were to operate under assumption that change is uncomfortable and should thus be prevented with extra effort, the server would make no progress at all. The sentiment behind "Change is uncomfortable to people" is that people often have an illogical and unreasonable gut feeling against change that should be overlooked for the sake of progress.

That ties in with most plugin developments, however there are some corner cases. I've tasked (or asked) the PVP staff to be inquisitive, to look further than their first assumptions carried their reasoning. The first assumption made is that this will be annoying to people because it ruins their PVP experience. Rather than reverting this change, what's so say the behavior behind the PVP is actually at fault and should change? What's so good about constantly hopping the border of a faction? Can this be prevented with new implementations? Can we change something in the configuration that would avoid the annoyance of the implementation without flat out dedicating resources where they would best be spent elsewhere?

MassiveCraft employs more critical thinking than most people assume, which is why a week grace period is usually requested/enforced for the relevant parties to make their investigations. @Grixer has already started investigating the leads I have presented to him, and I eagerly await the outcome. If the outcome will be to code a toggle, so be it.

 

[Gwyndo]

So I am basically not allowed to ask a question?


@HandsomeJack I disagreed to you because I didn't think disabling it in PvP was the solution. But your spite of disagreeing to a question makes no sense.

Now I am out of this because being spite rated when asking a question.

EDIT: Also saying that I spite when I am just disagreeing to an opinion is not very nice.

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No, you disagreed specifically after I disagreed to your statement. Just because you put a questionmark at the end of your statement doesn't make people unable to disagree with it. So no, I was not spite rating because I was not rating in response to a rating. (Which you were.)

and do not rate this read more, as read more is for facts, not opinion.\

Also - Reason for Disagree - I was not spite rating you, as I just explained.

*Edit* I removed my disagree, as throwing yet another negative rating at you for this just seems childish at this point. I propose we either stop here or delete our comments as to not cluster the thread

 

[Jutiere]

If the server were to operate under assumption that change is uncomfortable and should thus be prevented with extra effort, the server would make no progress at all. The sentiment behind "Change is uncomfortable to people" is that people often have an illogical and unreasonable gut feeling against change that should be overlooked for the sake of progress.

That ties in with most plugin developments, however there are some corner cases. I've tasked (or asked) the PVP staff to be inquisitive, to look further than their first assumptions carried their reasoning. The first assumption made is that this will be annoying to people because it ruins their PVP experience. Rather than reverting this change, what's so say the behavior behind the PVP is actually at fault and should change? What's so good about constantly hopping the border of a faction? Can this be prevented with new implementations? Can we change something in the configuration that would avoid the annoyance of the implementation without flat out dedicating resources where they would best be spent elsewhere?

MassiveCraft employs more critical thinking than most people assume, which is why a week grace period is usually requested/enforced for the relevant parties to make their investigations. @Grixer has already started investigating the leads I have presented to him, and I eagerly await the outcome. If the outcome will be to code a toggle, so be it.

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• For some reason, every time I read a post that MonMarty does I seem to agree with him.

• There is no reason to argue over forums. A simple post about your opinion would be enough.

• As for my opinion, I do believe that this would interfere with the PvP aspect of MassiveCraft but I also think it is handy for finding factions instead of having to type the /f map command all the time.

 

[BenRekt]

• For some reason, every time I read a post that MonMarty does I seem to agree with him.

• There is no reason to argue over forums. A simple post about your opinion would be enough.

• As for my opinion, I do believe that this would interfere with the PvP aspect of MassiveCraft but I also think it is handy for finding factions instead of having to type the /f map command all the time.

Click to shrink...

People will still have to do /f map. This 'feature' has been around for a while but instead of coming up in the middle of your screen, it would come up in the chat box.

 

[Jutiere]

People will still have to do /f map. This 'feature' has been around for a while but instead of coming up in the middle of your screen, it would come up in the chat box.

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• I understand that /f map will still be around.

 

[Joshy54100]

• There is no reason to argue over forums. A simple post about your opinion would be enough.

Click to shrink...

Who are you referring to here?

 

[Ha5h]

I personally LOVE seeing the name of my faction shining on my screen. It's like a welcoming party... To myself... Forever alone.

 

[feiooos]

If the server were to operate under assumption that change is uncomfortable and should thus be prevented with extra effort, the server would make no progress at all. The sentiment behind "Change is uncomfortable to people" is that people often have an illogical and unreasonable gut feeling against change that should be overlooked for the sake of progress.

That ties in with most plugin developments, however there are some corner cases. I've tasked (or asked) the PVP staff to be inquisitive, to look further than their first assumptions carried their reasoning. The first assumption made is that this will be annoying to people because it ruins their PVP experience. Rather than reverting this change, what's so say the behavior behind the PVP is actually at fault and should change? What's so good about constantly hopping the border of a faction? Can this be prevented with new implementations? Can we change something in the configuration that would avoid the annoyance of the implementation without flat out dedicating resources where they would best be spent elsewhere?

MassiveCraft employs more critical thinking than most people assume, which is why a week grace period is usually requested/enforced for the relevant parties to make their investigations. @Grixer has already started investigating the leads I have presented to him, and I eagerly await the outcome. If the outcome will be to code a toggle, so be it.

Click to shrink...

Marty, with no offense to anyone in the Staff team and without devaluate all your work so far, you should take in consideration the poll and all the opinions written here because I'm sure those who spoke here also follow other people's opinion that they just dont write on the forums. And I'm wondering if you even play on Massive at all because if you would you wouldn't be please by having this huge banner showing up in the middle of your screen all the time. You don't need to be a PvPer to be spammed at all, do some claiming work with your faction and you'll see the issue.
My opinion is to make it a bit more subtle - an easy fix would be Zihammer's suggestion - but either make it toggleable or not it should still be rethought about how its looks. You can also investigate a little bit on how other videogames preset new regions/areas, like the Elder Scrolls when you're exploring different regions.
But again, I meant no disrespect the Staff work to attempt on making this server the best one out there, because it is and the latest PvP improvements were the cherry on top of the cake.

 

[CanteringCodfish]

an easy fix would be Zihammer's suggestion

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@ZIHAMMER1411

Not possible currently. Maybe go nag Dinnerbone to add that

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[feiooos]

And who's that? Is it that hard to change X and Y coords?

 

[CanteringCodfish]

And who's that? Is it that hard to change X and Y coords?

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Madus is a staff member who programs all (or a lot) of the stuffs.....

 

[feiooos]

Madus is a staff member who programs all (or a lot) of the stuffs.....

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I meant "Dinnerbone" but ok...

 

[Joshy54100]

I meant "Dinnerbone" but ok...

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Dinnerbone is one of the lead Minecraft/Bukkit developers.

 

[Mecharic]

Togglelize it! No reason to get rid of it on behalf of solely the PvPers, no reason to force it on everyone for the RPers.

 

[MonMarty]

Marty, with no offense to anyone in the Staff team and without devaluate all your work so far, you should take in consideration the poll and all the opinions written here because I'm sure those who spoke here also follow other people's opinion that they just dont write on the forums. And I'm wondering if you even play on Massive at all because if you would you wouldn't be please by having this huge banner showing up in the middle of your screen all the time. You don't need to be a PvPer to be spammed at all, do some claiming work with your faction and you'll see the issue.
My opinion is to make it a bit more subtle - an easy fix would be Zihammer's suggestion - but either make it toggleable or not it should still be rethought about how its looks. You can also investigate a little bit on how other videogames preset new regions/areas, like the Elder Scrolls when you're exploring different regions.
But again, I meant no disrespect the Staff work to attempt on making this server the best one out there, because it is and the latest PvP improvements were the cherry on top of the cake.

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I'll take the opinions of 32 people on 2200 into account when it's appropriate to do so. It's important not to overstate the value of such a low number.

On the same matter, research by people who don't immediately jump to a single solution is more valuable. If what tactic you are suggesting had applied, none of the premiums would continue to have their "keep armor on death" There was a poll strongly in favor of removing the non drop feature altogether, and further research resulting in a different, yet better approach.

To say something can only be done one way by the opinion of 28 people, is ignorant.

 

[feiooos]

I'll take the opinions of 32 people on 2200 into account when it's appropriate to do so. It's important not to overstate the value of such a low number.

On the same matter, research by people who don't immediately jump to a single solution is more valuable. If what tactic you are suggesting had applied, none of the premiums would continue to have their "keep armor on death" There was a poll strongly in favor of removing the non drop feature altogether, and further research resulting in a different, yet better approach.

To say something can only be done one way by the opinion of 28 people, is ignorant.

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As I said before I'm sure other people agree with suggestions made here but they just didn't state it or they don't bother in using the forums. And these 32 people probably spend more time online and participate in Massive's "road to perfection" than the 2200 altogether
Also what is your personal opinion on this feature Marty?

EDIT:I don't mean to flame, disrespect anyone or whatsoever. My spirit here is be constructive and to help!

 

[ZiHAMMER]

Then, to make it smaller, just put faction name in the subtitle (there is a description currently).

 

[Joshy54100]

I'll take the opinions of 32 people on 2200 into account when it's appropriate to do so. It's important not to overstate the value of such a low number.

On the same matter, research by people who don't immediately jump to a single solution is more valuable. If what tactic you are suggesting had applied, none of the premiums would continue to have their "keep armor on death" There was a poll strongly in favor of removing the non drop feature altogether, and further research resulting in a different, yet better approach.

To say something can only be done one way by the opinion of 28 people, is ignorant.

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Though, one question: why isn't toggling it the best solution by default? Shouldn't user preference come first? I'm just confused why we need to research this, since toggling it seems like the least divisive way to solve this problem. I'm not trying to question your way off doing it, just understand it.

 

[Madus]

Though, one question: why isn't toggling it the best solution by default? Shouldn't user preference come first? I'm just confused why we need to research this, since toggling it seems like the least divisive way to solve this problem. I'm not trying to question your way off doing it, just understand it.

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Too many options make some people confused, I am sure you and many others can handle it but not everyone can that is why not everything is toggleable per default (not saying this shouldn't be toggleable just trying to guess why it wasn't per default)

And who's that? Is it that hard to change X and Y coords?

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It is a feature implemented by Mojang, just like we can't move the chat box we can't move the titles, but being able to move them would however be nice

 

[Joshy54100]

Too many options make some people confused, I am sure you and many others can handle it but not everyone can that is why not everything is toggleable per default (not saying this shouldn't be toggleable just trying to guess why it wasn't per default)

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I made this thread specifically because I don't want to have to handle it

 

[Gerrior]

In my opinion I really like the idea behind it however the duration of it ruins the old mapping scheme of it showing up in chat. For example, you step onto wilderness it instantly pops up in chat and vice versa onto factionland. Now with this you have to go back and forth search for the "Line of Safety"

 

[MonMarty]

Though, one question: why isn't toggling it the best solution by default? Shouldn't user preference come first? I'm just confused why we need to research this, since toggling it seems like the least divisive way to solve this problem. I'm not trying to question your way off doing it, just understand it.

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The first logical option is never the only best option. In many cases users simply haven't considered other options, and in other cases another problem might be at work entirely. If a calf falls down a well and it drowns, the obvious solution would be to close the well, but what if the stupidity of the cow was the problem, or the height of the wall of the well, or the fact that the well doesn't have a fence etc etc. We like to look at a problem from all sides.

 

[Gerrior]

The first logical option is never the only best option. In many cases users simply haven't considered other options, and in other cases another problem might be at work entirely. If a calf falls down a well and it drowns, the obvious solution would be to close the well, but what if the stupidity of the cow was the problem, or the height of the wall of the well, or the fact that the well doesn't have a fence etc etc. We like to look at a problem from all sides.

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Tis very true, however the problem is, the new update becomes more of nuissance than "magical" or a nice touch. As I stated above it conflicts with builders whom used the older alert for declaring the outskirts of their land for the protection of their builds. With this, it becomes more of a problem with the fadeaway duration causing the player to have to walk to and fro looking for the exactly "line."

Yes It does add a nice touch and feel however the location of it as well introduces conflict for pvpers being center of mass.

 

[Mecharic]

Tis very true, however the problem is, the new update becomes more of nuissance than "magical" or a nice touch. As I stated above it conflicts with builders whom used the older alert for declaring the outskirts of their land for the protection of their builds. With this, it becomes more of a problem with the fadeaway duration causing the player to have to walk to and fro looking for the exactly "line."

Yes It does add a nice touch and feel however the location of it as well introduces conflict for pvpers being center of mass.

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What "line" are they looking for? Can't they just do /f sc to see the chunks that factions run on? Why use a chat screen to do that when you can use /f sc?

MonMarty just explained that the location cannot be moved by MassiveCraft because Mojang.

 

[Gerrior]

What "line" are they looking for? Can't they just do /f sc to see the chunks that factions run on? Why use a chat screen to do that when you can use /f sc?

MonMarty just explained that the location cannot be moved by MassiveCraft because Mojang.

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Yes okay it's out of their league but I use the "line" to help me ensure I am within faction terrority and the reasoning behind it is because it's instant and tells me right away. I don't have to pause and back track to pinpoint the exactly dimensions. Plus, I never knew there was a /f sc

 

[Mecharic]

Yes okay it's out of their league but I use the "line" to help me ensure I am within faction terrority and the reasoning behind it is because it's instant and tells me right away. I don't have to pause and back track to pinpoint the exactly dimensions. Plus, I never knew there was a /f sc

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Well, now knowing that you can use /f sc to show the outline of any chunk (claimed or otherwise) do you still think that this feature needs to change for the purpose of making it easier for builders to find chunk edges?

 

[Gerrior]

Well, now knowing that you can use /f sc to show the outline of any chunk (claimed or otherwise) do you still think that this feature needs to change for the purpose of making it easier for builders to find chunk edges?

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Maybe not for a builders point of view now that I am aware of /f sc however what about the pvpers point of view, is there a way to decrease the font size? Seeing that well, you cannot see.

 

[Mecharic]

Maybe not for a builders point of view now that I am aware of /f sc however what about the pvpers point of view, is there a way to decrease the font size? Seeing that well, you cannot see.

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A toggle would work best, but failing that smaller font size would work I'm sure.