Archived Cannon World

[Conflee]

Hello everyone! So, I'm going to admit right off the bat that I am not really a survival player- though in the past I have been an avid player of factions of other servers, and in the future I intend to try to get into survival on here especially for MassiveMagic. That being said though, one of the main reasons I do not play Factions here is the.... lack of risk? In my opinion at least.

As it stands, due to how easy it is to get dubs of god gear, and how much of that gear is just floating around the economy making it essentially worthless, and the fact that you pretty much can't be raided if you build a wall, factions feels risk free at the moment. Which, is fine, for the builders and RP factions out there who just chill. But personally for me, the most fun in factions is the risk reward balance.

I used to play on [Insert Generic Server Name] and for the longest time it felt, slow. But I knew factions- I watched the old 2620 videos which even though the resolution is a bit rubbish compared to today's standard, they were and still are the apex of factions as I see it. They played like how Massive plays- building castle walls and fortifications, not concerned with the modern defences like sand walls and 45 degree walls, or artificial oceans to stop cannoning. But cannoning was still a thing. They fought glorious battles defending the gates of their city for days straight from waves of invaders, patching their walls frantically as arrows flew, it was honestly the most amazing crap I have seen.

Beyond that fanboy ranting lol, my point is, I only enjoy factions when there is a substantial risk. It has to be kill or be killed, that desperate war to stay hidden and defended until the inevitable happens and you are found, and the adrenaline rush of battling off the enemy while you attempt to grab your valuables and run to a bunker or backup base. Its amazing.

Massive, on the other hand, has more or less entirely removed this aspect of factions. TNT does not even work as far as I am aware, let alone cannons. So, my suggestions is simple enough: A Cannon World. A world where cannons function normally, but all rules about building still hold true, so you cant make the ungodly, laggy defences of modern servers.


Optionals:

* Have a larger map - In order for bases to really be hidden for any amount of time, a larger map is needed. If you can walk 10 minutes to get to any of the major faction bases on the map its not quite the same epic feeling when you do stumble across a huge base by a powerful faction your enemies with.

* Separate economy and items - This one would be the hardest, but in my opinion to add risk it nearly needs to be a thing. As it stands as I said, God Gear is overflowing in the current economy. Backpacks and Enderchests would need to be entirely inaccessible, and inventories would need to be seperate, with /trade disallowed to prevent smuggling items across. Shops wold just be basic, with probably sign shops for the very basic materials at spawn. Gift4All gear would not be given to players currently in the Cannoning World either.

* No whining - Raiding, cannoning, all that 'nasty' stuff would be fully allowed, anyone who tries to throw a fit and wont stop after being warned gets the mute. Make it obvious when someone enters the world its HIGH risk, so they have no right to complain- the only reason they wouldn't know is if they can't read, and if they cant read oh god how did they manage to make it to us anyway right?

* Everyone has access to all chests - This one is a bit harsher than the rest, but I think that everyone should be able to open chests anywhere. This makes raiding a more appealing task as you wont have to tear someone's base in half to get their loot. On top of this, people who do just want to patch their walls have an easier time because its just their walls and not 3/4ths of their base missing usually. Covering chests with devices to 'lock' them would be allowed as well, but MassiveLock would need to be prohibited to avoid people loopholing that system.



Either way, I am interested in thoughts. I know the biggest bar to this is probably lag, given having a world where tnt cannons work is a bit of a strain sometimes, but honestly I feel like Massive can handle it given that every other server on PMC can (aye a joke about how common canon servers are) .

That reminds me as well I'll probably just get comments saying to play on a different server then but honestly I prefer Massive, its a great community, just not with the exact features I enjoy for survival. Also I doubt I am alone in the love of cannoning, given the most popular factions servers tend to advertize as cannon friendly with their tick rates and such working in favor of complex designs. People clearly share this love lol

 

[aprader1]

As you probably know Massive is the original owner of the factions plug in and as the original owner it should stay true to its roots. It was other servers that made it chaotic. Honestly there are to many factions servers already that operate like that already. If massive implements this they will get lost in all the chaos. This isn't even to mention the strain it would cause making the server virtually unplayable. We all saw what happened when warp market was not split into different zones. Honestly it's to much work and to generic.

 

[FireFan96]

I'm mixed to this. I came from servers such as these, where tnt cannon building and wall defenses were what made you the ruler of the map or the plebeian getting picked off of spawn on day one. I was controlled chaos so to speak, and generally was enjoyable if you had enough buddies and the time to prepare.

I suppose the only real thing that I enjoyed was blowing bases up and going in to raid chests. I remember the days when you had to place a sand block over every chest so raiders couldn't get in. Heck I did that here when I started up. Those were fun times.

Though, massive has carved a system (can I even call it that?) where some of these things do not apply. You don't have giant cobble boxes (<3) in the sky, you have walled cities. Watering the corners doesn't exist here, because builds must look somewhat realistic.

I will say the following points:

• tnt should be enabled regardless. sure you could have a faction member blow up the base, but I believe you could simply change a faction perm and there ya go. The wilderness doesn't really need tnt disabled because massiverestore fixes it anyways.
• chests should be able to be opened by anyone. That's why you spend the money to lock them. Or place sand on top of them. It's factions 101 to make sure your loot is protected, and chests just lying around asking to be raided deserve to be. If you have valuable dirt you want to protect, massivelock is the answer, not a faction perm.
  
• I kinda think any unlocked blocks should be able to be blown up by cannon fire, but then regens after a while. This one I'm iffy on, since regenerating an entire city wall could be laggy, and that's a no go.

 

[Conflee]

As you probably know Massive is the original owner of the factions plug in and as the original owner it should stay true to its roots. It was other servers that made it chaotic. Honestly there are to many factions servers already that operate like that already. If massive implements this they will get lost in all the chaos. This isn't even to mention the strain it would cause making the server virtually unplayable. We all saw what happened when warp market was not split into different zones. Honestly it's to much work and to generic.

Click to shrink...

Just because something is first doesn't always mean it is the best. Besides, there are already what, 6-7 worlds with the standard factions setup. Those would still stay, this would just be more of an addition.

Also, the Market lag isnt so much from chests as it is from the 37 BILLION particles the locks give off. The main ring still lags for me if I dont turn particles off, though having them separated has helped.

 

[Jalapeno690]

Cannons were already an item on the server, they were removed 2 years ago due to lag. I know where you are coming from but cannons blowing up builds is just a disaster, many people put allot of time and effort into their builds on massive unlike other servers and I think the ability to destroy these even if they do restore to their original shape will just put people off the server more. Personally i'm not a fan of cannons that cause wide spread carnage, you can use TNT to blow people up if they are close enough by, by firing a flaming arrow at it which I think adds enough siege mentallity as it is

 

[65jes89]

Cannons were already an item on the server, they were removed 2 years ago due to lag. I know where you are coming from but cannons blowing up builds is just a disaster, many people put allot of time and effort into their builds on massive unlike other servers and I think the ability to destroy these even if they do restore to their original shape will just put people off the server more. Personally i'm not a fan of cannons that cause wide spread carnage, you can use TNT to blow people up if they are close enough by, by firing a flaming arrow at it which I think adds enough siege mentallity as it is

Click to shrink...

The cannons removed two years ago are completely unrelated from the cannons talked about in op. Op is talking about TNT cannons, which only cause lag when launched/exploding, the ones you're talking about constantly cause lag because they caught every single redstone update event, of which there are enough to cause a substantial amount of lag.

 

[Conflee]

Cannons were already an item on the server, they were removed 2 years ago due to lag. I know where you are coming from but cannons blowing up builds is just a disaster, many people put allot of time and effort into their builds on massive unlike other servers and I think the ability to destroy these even if they do restore to their original shape will just put people off the server more. Personally i'm not a fan of cannons that cause wide spread carnage, you can use TNT to blow people up if they are close enough by, by firing a flaming arrow at it which I think adds enough siege mentallity as it is

Click to shrink...

It would be in its own separate world like I said, with a separate economy etc if possible. So it shouldnt have any effect on the existing worlds.

 

[CptSilvyrall]

Hello everyone! So, I'm going to admit right off the bat that I am not really a survival player- though in the past I have been an avid player of factions of other servers, and in the future I intend to try to get into survival on here especially for MassiveMagic. That being said though, one of the main reasons I do not play Factions here is the.... lack of risk? In my opinion at least.

As it stands, due to how easy it is to get dubs of god gear, and how much of that gear is just floating around the economy making it essentially worthless, and the fact that you pretty much can't be raided if you build a wall, factions feels risk free at the moment. Which, is fine, for the builders and RP factions out there who just chill. But personally for me, the most fun in factions is the risk reward balance.

I used to play on [Insert Generic Server Name] and for the longest time it felt, slow. But I knew factions- I watched the old 2620 videos which even though the resolution is a bit rubbish compared to today's standard, they were and still are the apex of factions as I see it. They played like how Massive plays- building castle walls and fortifications, not concerned with the modern defences like sand walls and 45 degree walls, or artificial oceans to stop cannoning. But cannoning was still a thing. They fought glorious battles defending the gates of their city for days straight from waves of invaders, patching their walls frantically as arrows flew, it was honestly the most amazing crap I have seen.

Beyond that fanboy ranting lol, my point is, I only enjoy factions when there is a substantial risk. It has to be kill or be killed, that desperate war to stay hidden and defended until the inevitable happens and you are found, and the adrenaline rush of battling off the enemy while you attempt to grab your valuables and run to a bunker or backup base. Its amazing.

Massive, on the other hand, has more or less entirely removed this aspect of factions. TNT does not even work as far as I am aware, let alone cannons. So, my suggestions is simple enough: A Cannon World. A world where cannons function normally, but all rules about building still hold true, so you cant make the ungodly, laggy defences of modern servers.


Optionals:

* Have a larger map - In order for bases to really be hidden for any amount of time, a larger map is needed. If you can walk 10 minutes to get to any of the major faction bases on the map its not quite the same epic feeling when you do stumble across a huge base by a powerful faction your enemies with.

* Separate economy and items - This one would be the hardest, but in my opinion to add risk it nearly needs to be a thing. As it stands as I said, God Gear is overflowing in the current economy. Backpacks and Enderchests would need to be entirely inaccessible, and inventories would need to be seperate, with /trade disallowed to prevent smuggling items across. Shops wold just be basic, with probably sign shops for the very basic materials at spawn. Gift4All gear would not be given to players currently in the Cannoning World either.

* No whining - Raiding, cannoning, all that 'nasty' stuff would be fully allowed, anyone who tries to throw a fit and wont stop after being warned gets the mute. Make it obvious when someone enters the world its HIGH risk, so they have no right to complain- the only reason they wouldn't know is if they can't read, and if they cant read oh god how did they manage to make it to us anyway right?

* Everyone has access to all chests - This one is a bit harsher than the rest, but I think that everyone should be able to open chests anywhere. This makes raiding a more appealing task as you wont have to tear someone's base in half to get their loot. On top of this, people who do just want to patch their walls have an easier time because its just their walls and not 3/4ths of their base missing usually. Covering chests with devices to 'lock' them would be allowed as well, but MassiveLock would need to be prohibited to avoid people loopholing that system.



Either way, I am interested in thoughts. I know the biggest bar to this is probably lag, given having a world where tnt cannons work is a bit of a strain sometimes, but honestly I feel like Massive can handle it given that every other server on PMC can (aye a joke about how common canon servers are) .

That reminds me as well I'll probably just get comments saying to play on a different server then but honestly I prefer Massive, its a great community, just not with the exact features I enjoy for survival. Also I doubt I am alone in the love of cannoning, given the most popular factions servers tend to advertize as cannon friendly with their tick rates and such working in favor of complex designs. People clearly share this love lol

Click to shrink...

I'm mixed to this. I came from servers such as these, where tnt cannon building and wall defenses were what made you the ruler of the map or the plebeian getting picked off of spawn on day one. I was controlled chaos so to speak, and generally was enjoyable if you had enough buddies and the time to prepare.

I suppose the only real thing that I enjoyed was blowing bases up and going in to raid chests. I remember the days when you had to place a sand block over every chest so raiders couldn't get in. Heck I did that here when I started up. Those were fun times.

Though, massive has carved a system (can I even call it that?) where some of these things do not apply. You don't have giant cobble boxes (<3) in the sky, you have walled cities. Watering the corners doesn't exist here, because builds must look somewhat realistic.

I will say the following points:

• tnt should be enabled regardless. sure you could have a faction member blow up the base, but I believe you could simply change a faction perm and there ya go. The wilderness doesn't really need tnt disabled because massiverestore fixes it anyways.
• chests should be able to be opened by anyone. That's why you spend the money to lock them. Or place sand on top of them. It's factions 101 to make sure your loot is protected, and chests just lying around asking to be raided deserve to be. If you have valuable dirt you want to protect, massivelock is the answer, not a faction perm.
  
• I kinda think any unlocked blocks should be able to be blown up by cannon fire, but then regens after a while. This one I'm iffy on, since regenerating an entire city wall could be laggy, and that's a no go.

Click to shrink...

I also agree with this in a mixed sort of way. The whole reason factions is dead is probably because it's not like the old blow up the base with a TNT cannon and loot sort of game. But yes it would loose allot of people and cause them to build unrealistic things violating that rule. I really think it would be nice to have this back, but lots of people don't. Which is the very problem.

 

[Conflee]

I also agree with this in a mixed sort of way. The whole reason factions is dead is probably because it's not like the old blow up the base with a TNT cannon and loot sort of game. But yes it would loose allot of people and cause them to build unrealistic things violating that rule. I really think it would be nice to have this back, but lots of people don't. Which is the very problem.

Click to shrink...

There are other servers I have seen that go for this kind of middle approach. Build rules etc with a medieval theme. The solution is a simply plugin to change block's Blast Resistance. For instance, you could make brick and stone brick as resistant as endstone is in vanilla, and people could still add "Cores" to their walls to beef up resistance further without detracting from the look of it.

 

[Gethelp]

The cannons removed two years ago are completely unrelated from the cannons talked about in op. Op is talking about TNT cannons, which only cause lag when launched/exploding, the ones you're talking about constantly cause lag because they caught every single redstone update event, of which there are enough to cause a substantial amount of lag.

Click to shrink...

most of the lag from tnt cannons are are client side only cannon i have seen lag a servers are 250+ stackers and that shooting about 500+ sand and a LOT of tnt

 

[Jalapeno690]

It would be in its own separate world like I said, with a separate economy etc if possible. So it shouldnt have any effect on the existing worlds.

Click to shrink...

That is still deflecting from the factions world, similar to what regalia is doing in my opinion. The reason massive has been so successful is due to the one economy no matter which world you enter, a sense of continuity between worlds, I'm all for cannons but the destruction they cause and for the most part from what I have seen elsewhere the nerd poles they leave just don't appeal to me, now if you were some how to add this TNT cannon idea and potentially mix it with a similar design to that used in the past cannons with as little destruction as possible then i'd be totally supportive of the idea. It could lead to a greater siege mentality within factions, giving them an objective to capture and wipe out their opponents cannons, just a thought

 

[Conflee]

That is still deflecting from the factions world, similar to what regalia is doing in my opinion. The reason massive has been so successful is due to the one economy no matter which world you enter, a sense of continuity between worlds, I'm all for cannons but the destruction they cause and for the most part from what I have seen elsewhere the nerd poles they leave just don't appeal to me, now if you were some how to add this TNT cannon idea and potentially mix it with a similar design to that used in the past cannons with as little destruction as possible then i'd be totally supportive of the idea. It could lead to a greater siege mentality within factions, giving them an objective to capture and wipe out their opponents cannons, just a thought

Click to shrink...

There was one idea a while back to have canons work but not damage chests- and making hest wall defenses illegal- and having the blocks regen, but that was shot down due to lag.

 

[65jes89]

That is still deflecting from the factions world, similar to what regalia is doing in my opinion. The reason massive has been so successful is due to the one economy no matter which world you enter, a sense of continuity between worlds, I'm all for cannons but the destruction they cause and for the most part from what I have seen elsewhere the nerd poles they leave just don't appeal to me, now if you were some how to add this TNT cannon idea and potentially mix it with a similar design to that used in the past cannons with as little destruction as possible then i'd be totally supportive of the idea. It could lead to a greater siege mentality within factions, giving them an objective to capture and wipe out their opponents cannons, just a thought

Click to shrink...

You realize massive's economy is pretty close to non existent at this point right

 

[Jalapeno690]

You realize massive's economy is pretty close to non existent at this point right

Click to shrink...

True but when I say economy I speak solely on you are in the same financial position no matter which world you travel into each are balanced monetary wise, unlike other factions servers where each world/map has its own monetary economy and when you enter one you start afresh compared to a similar map on the same server where you could have 100,000 credits and god armour galore

 

[Conflee]

True but when I say economy I speak solely on you are in the same financial position no matter which world you travel into each are balanced monetary wise, unlike other factions servers where each world/map has its own monetary economy and when you enter one you start afresh compared to a similar map on the same server where you could have 100,000 credits and god armour galore

Click to shrink...

My main issue with keeping the economy the same is the fact that Massive's economy is a mess. Its more harm to have the new world inherit that clustered tangle of wires than it is to sub-divide it and give it a fresh life in my opinion.